300 PRC update

dfp dfp

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Jan 10, 2019
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Dave, after how many rounds do you recommend cleaning a 300nm?

thank you
I am having MPA build one for me...being that it is new-ish they are just running with specs from hornady...they stated all our testing was done with a 26" 1 in 8 and was "great"...I have asked them to see if I can get it to 28"...their blanks online stat 27"...so it will show up in 6 to 8 weeks with 26 to 28" berral with a 1 and 8 twist...
I figure it's just a starter anyway...we will shoot...read up....test...and swap berral out with any adjustments I see fit....if 300 PRC produces the numbers...it will stay a PRC...
 

jwknutson17

Big Game Hunter
Apr 29, 2017
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My barreled action will be here from DT tomorrow and plan on taking it out the following weekend. Will only be able to shoot it through 700 yards but will be interested to see how it does. 26" and 9.4 twist. In 300 PRC.

I also have a new 27" 300 Norma mag I'll bring out and shoot both side by side with FACTORY Hornady 225 eldm, and see what my Chrono says and what the difference is. I don't have my 26" 300 Norma proof barrel yet (been 5 months) to swap in the AXMC and compare same barrel lengths just yet.
 

dfp dfp

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Jan 10, 2019
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My barreled action will be here from DT tomorrow and plan on taking it out the following weekend. Will only be able to shoot it through 700 yards but will be interested to see how it does. 26" and 9.4 twist. In 300 PRC.

I also have a new 27" 300 Norma mag I'll bring out and shoot both side by side with FACTORY Hornady 225 eldm, and see what my Chrono says and what the difference is. I don't have my 26" 300 Norma proof barrel yet (been 5 months) to swap in the AXMC and compare same barrel lengths just yet.
Awesome... please let us know how it shakes out...
 

DAVETOOLEY

Gunny Sergeant
Jun 14, 2009
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Dave, after how many rounds do you recommend cleaning a 300nm?

thank you
I clean my Norma after every range visit regardless of the number of rounds. I don't want fouling, whether it's copper or carbon getting ahead of me. It just causes problems that you have to endure at the range , soon to be down range, and then endure an extended cleaning session. It's one of those pay me now or pay me later deals. With proper cleaning equipment you're not going to hurt the barrel. As barrels age cleaning becomes much more important as capacity and capacity vs. bore diameter changes. By that I mean 308 vs 6.5 CM.
 
Likes: jwknutson17
Aug 23, 2017
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I clean my Norma after every range visit regardless of the number of rounds. I don't want fouling, whether it's copper or carbon getting ahead of me. It just causes problems that you have to endure at the range , soon to be down range, and then endure an extended cleaning session. It's one of those pay me now or pay me later deals. With proper cleaning equipment you're not going to hurt the barrel. As barrels age cleaning becomes much more important as capacity and capacity vs. bore diameter changes. By that I mean 308 vs 6.5 CM.
Do you feel like you have to foul the barrel after cleaning or is it right on target on the first shot after cleaning?
 

jwknutson17

Big Game Hunter
Apr 29, 2017
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Many tanks to @DAVETOOLEY for rebarreling my Cadex rifle. Shaved 2 lbs off just from going from the factory 24 inch 300 win mag barrel to a proof Sendero 26 inch in 300 PRC. Measured from bolt face to muzzle and it's right at 26.25". So this thing should sling em!! Dave does amazing work. Can't wait to get rounds down range. Thanks again Dave/Tooley Custom Rifles.
 

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jwknutson17

Big Game Hunter
Apr 29, 2017
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So with this barrel I am at...

3.700 coal to lands with the 225 Eldm
3.662 coal to lands with the 212 eldx
3.620 coal to lands with the 215 Hybrids

So I am 24 thou from the lands with factory 225 eldm, 12 thou from lands with factory 212 eldx. Works for me. Hope that helps someone with doubts about reamers. Seems like its pretty spot on.
 

dfp dfp

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Jan 10, 2019
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I too can not speak of the 300...yet... but what I have experienced is that if I do an extensive barrel break in a foulR is not needed....but if I dont do a good break In a foulR shows some signs of being needed....and each berral shows that it requires different attention....I just installed a Krieger on my 6.5 with extensive break in and 2nd shot will be in the same hole as the 1st shot at 100 after cleaning....factory barrel did not do that but I did not break it in at all...as I was testing that theory.... wont ever do that again...

Good lookin stick and thanks for pics jwknutson.....
Cant wait to see what you think...
 

DAVETOOLEY

Gunny Sergeant
Jun 14, 2009
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Do you feel like you have to foul the barrel after cleaning or is it right on target on the first shot after cleaning?
I've shot hundreds of clean cold bore shots at 1K out of target rifles. The first shot goes 14"-18" low. We would bet on closest to the clay bird on the first shot. It was that predictable.
 
Feb 21, 2013
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Can anyone comment on the brass consistency for the 300 PRC? I have been steered away from the cartridge by several builders due to Hornady brass quality and advised to think about a Norma. Not really wanting to do that but I also don't want issues at long range because of inferior brass either.
 
Feb 21, 2013
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Inconsistent weights, internal volume, primer pockets, dimensional variances and anything else that are held to a higher standard with other companies like Lapua and Norma. If it was just an isolated internet rumor that would be one thing, but it's talked about enough within the shooting community to have me slightly concerned. I'm building this because of it's design advantages over other .30 caliber cartridges and because factory loaded ammo is available. I have no time for hours of brass prep.
 
Feb 24, 2013
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My appointment still good Dave?
I went through the dilemma on the Brass question. I've had horrible luck with Nosler Brass in my 7SAUM.
At $2 apiece, 3rd firing and it was done!, Remington brass has been great with prep work. 7 firings.
Norma, Not so good either. I've never shot Hornady but if I get 3-5 loads out of it, I'm good
 
Apr 29, 2017
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I'm hoping ADG or Peterson comes out with brass. Have 300 ct of Hornady to get me by until then. ADG brass on my 300 win mag has 11 firings and pockets are still tight with a hot load through it Been very impressed for the price.
 
Jun 14, 2009
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I'm not defending Hornady here. This nothing they don't know. There are a bunch of target shooters there using this round and it's nothing I haven't mentioned to them over the years.
When it comes to maximizing performance for the most part, we and I mean all of us are going to load to pressures that are just below or equal to the yield point of the brass. Every manufactures toughness differs and every lot can be different. So if you want primer pockets to last you make adjustments. I want reasonable longevity and precision. They are not exclusive. It's just that simple. If you want 300 Norma performance then build one. I'll agree the necks aren't as uniform as I would like. Norma and Lapua usually vary a .001". Sometimes less. I've measured PRC brass and it varies .0015" on some cases. Probably 35% are that way. That was with a very early lot. I neck turn it for my target rifles. I think a light skim cut on the necks would be the first thing I would do if I was concerned about uniformity. That would apply to any manufacturer. I shoot it as is in everything else. No one can convince me we can accurately measure internal capacity and then show me on the target that it matters. It gets lost in the noise.
Then let's talk price. 300 PRC is less than $1 ea and everything else mentioned is over $2.
Get 200 pcs and wear the barrel out.
In a perfect world RWS would make me PRC brass. That stuff lasts forever.
YMMV
 
Feb 21, 2013
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Like I stated earlier in this thread if your wanting better brass fire form the RWS or Norma 8x68s brass.
https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/forming-375-ruger-brass-from-8x68s-cases.206507/
I'm looking for a loaded factory round that takes advantage of newer, long range bullets so I can spend the little free time that I have shooting and not screwing around with brass. That may change in the future but my needs right now were filled when this cartridge was released.
 
Feb 21, 2013
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I'm not defending Hornady here. This nothing they don't know. There are a bunch of target shooters there using this round and it's nothing I haven't mentioned to them over the years.
When it comes to maximizing performance for the most part, we and I mean all of us are going to load to pressures that are just below or equal to the yield point of the brass. Every manufactures toughness differs and every lot can be different. So if you want primer pockets to last you make adjustments. I want reasonable longevity and precision. They are not exclusive. It's just that simple. If you want 300 Norma performance then build one. I'll agree the necks aren't as uniform as I would like. Norma and Lapua usually vary a .001". Sometimes less. I've measured PRC brass and it varies .0015" on some cases. Probably 35% are that way. That was with a very early lot. I neck turn it for my target rifles. I think a light skim cut on the necks would be the first thing I would do if I was concerned about uniformity. That would apply to any manufacturer. I shoot it as is in everything else. No one can convince me we can accurately measure internal capacity and then show me on the target that it matters. It gets lost in the noise.
Then let's talk price. 300 PRC is less than $1 ea and everything else mentioned is over $2.
Get 200 pcs and wear the barrel out.
In a perfect world RWS would make me PRC brass. That stuff lasts forever.
YMMV
Fair enough. I'm not looking for 300 Norma performance, I'm just looking for the 300 PRC performance to not be held back by shitty brass. I have no clue if Hornady sorts their cases for match loads. I need the factory ammo or I'm paying out the ass for someone to develop a load and produce it for me. Time is not on my side with my job and life outside of shooting. I would prefer to spend it at a range as much as possible when I do have it available.
 
Feb 21, 2013
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If that works for you great. If you have the time and money and motivation there are better options. Happy shooting
I will never dispute what's capable through hand loading. I would not come close to the performance I have achieved with my 10mm if I didn't load my own so I get it. I just need to find a cartridge that has decent factory support for shooting at the distances I want to shoot at and when my time frees up down the road I will hit the reloading station.
 
Jun 9, 2009
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Hornady brass is fine for longevity if you don't exceed 60ksi. Easy enough to get 10+ loads on my 308, 6.5 creedmoor and SAUM brass. I've stopped buying Lapua brass because for my purposes the Hornady is cheaper and does the job. That may vary person to person, especially if you're a speed freak.
 
Jun 9, 2009
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Yeah I'm piecing one together in a Nucleus. I have everything except a barrel at this point. I'm waiting for Bartlein to get to my order, 30" medium Palma 1:9.5 to 1:9 gain twist (for style points. Straight 1:9 probably could've achieved the same thing, $50 cheaper). I have a 6.5 SAUM barrel for my S/A Mausingfield screwed into it right now, for the time being.

I have the action sitting in a Manners T2A with their DBM mini-chassis set up for CIP magazines. I've put a dummy 300 PRC cartridge I have in my Accurate Mag 300wm CIP (3.850") magazines, and it easily feeds as far as the 300 PRC will go into the 6.5 SAUM chamber. CRF engages as soon as it snaps out of the feed lips, and it ejects as expected so I don't think I'll have any issues there.

Got a 20 MOA rail, and an ARC M10 20 MOA 1-piece mount (40 total). Hoping the extra height over bore will get me so I'm not looking through my suppressor at 1500+yd with the long barrel. Just got a Vortex AMG 6-24 in the mail today, can't wait to get that mounted up. Not sure when the barrel will be complete. 1-3 months left I'd guess.
 
Oct 1, 2007
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I will never dispute what's capable through hand loading. I would not come close to the performance I have achieved with my 10mm if I didn't load my own so I get it. I just need to find a cartridge that has decent factory support for shooting at the distances I want to shoot at and when my time frees up down the road I will hit the reloading station.
If you're looking for quality factory ammo why do you care about the quality of the brass? Hornady has proven they can produce accurate factory ammo at reasonable prices, what else matters?
 
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Feb 21, 2013
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If you're looking for quality factory ammo why do you care about the quality of the brass? Hornady has proven they can produce accurate factory ammo at reasonable prices, what else matters?
Case variances affect accuracy whether its factory ammo or hand loaded. It seems most folks have to sort and prep Hornady cases more than say Lapua or Norma, at least from the ones I've measured. Internal volume being the most inconsistent that I've found. Filling the case to the .05th grain every time is great but if the internal capacity varies by .5 gr that equals different pressure which equals different mv which equals high es which doesn't equal great vertical at a mile.

Necks that are not straight or uniform will cause problems with neck tension and so on.

Case in point. My buddy shot a 65 PRC with factory 147 into one hole at 100 yards but couldn't manage the vertical at a mile to even get on target. Was the brass the only reason, probably not but it probably didn't help. Everything matters at a mile.
 
Jun 14, 2009
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Case variances affect accuracy whether its factory ammo or hand loaded. It seems most folks have to sort and prep Hornady cases more than say Lapua or Norma, at least from the ones I've measured. Internal volume being the most inconsistent that I've found. Filling the case to the .05th grain every time is great but if the internal capacity varies by .5 gr that equals different pressure which equals different mv which equals high es which doesn't equal great vertical at a mile.

Necks that are not straight or uniform will cause problems with neck tension and so on.

Case in point. My buddy shot a 65 PRC with factory 147 into one hole at 100 yards but couldn't manage the vertical at a mile to even get on target. Was the brass the only reason, probably not but it probably didn't help. Everything matters at a mile.
Not trying to start anything here. Just have a conversation.
Expectations That covers a lot of territory in someone's mind. I don't think it's realistic to expect conveyor belt ammo, from any company to; 1. perform well at extreme distances. Some do, most don't. Or 2. perform as well as custom loaded ammo tuned for the individual rifle.
This is where the smaller niche ammo manufacturers come into play. I'm sure there are companies working on producing semi custom ammo for the 300 PRC as we speak.
I agree everything matters at a mile. There are no shortcuts if you have high expectations. Just saying.

Dave
 
Jan 23, 2013
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Not trying to start anything here. Just have a conversation.
Expectations That covers a lot of territory in someone's mind. I don't think it's realistic to expect conveyor belt ammo, from any company to; 1. perform well at extreme distances. Some do, most don't. Or 2. perform as well as custom loaded ammo tuned for the individual rifle.
This is where the smaller niche ammo manufacturers come into play. I'm sure there are companies working on producing semi custom ammo for the 300 PRC as we speak.
I agree everything matters at a mile. There are no shortcuts if you have high expectations. Just saying.

Dave
I agree 100%. There are no short cuts to long range and most definitely not ELR
 
Feb 21, 2013
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Not trying to start anything here. Just have a conversation.
Expectations That covers a lot of territory in someone's mind. I don't think it's realistic to expect conveyor belt ammo, from any company to; 1. perform well at extreme distances. Some do, most don't. Or 2. perform as well as custom loaded ammo tuned for the individual rifle.
This is where the smaller niche ammo manufacturers come into play. I'm sure there are companies working on producing semi custom ammo for the 300 PRC as we speak.
I agree everything matters at a mile. There are no shortcuts if you have high expectations. Just saying.

Dave
Conversations is how we learn and adjust. I digest a ton of input from the minds of many on this site because most have forgotten more than I will ever know. I believe you are one of them. I also understand real world results from my own experience and moved on the 7 SAUM for shooting at a mile as soon as this cartridge was announced.

Saying that, I don't have the expectations of putting every round on a 32x32 target at mile with factory ammo but a 75% hit ratio would be nice if I could manage the wind. Who's to say the factory ammo even shoots out of my particular rifle?

I believe my expectations are on par with the military. I believe they selected Hornady to supply their ammo recently. Yes I take that with a grain of salt but I'm also confident they expect to hit what they are aiming at.

As always thank you for the replies.
 
Likes: DAVETOOLEY
Oct 1, 2007
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Case variances affect accuracy whether its factory ammo or hand loaded. It seems most folks have to sort and prep Hornady cases more than say Lapua or Norma, at least from the ones I've measured. Internal volume being the most inconsistent that I've found. Filling the case to the .05th grain every time is great but if the internal capacity varies by .5 gr that equals different pressure which equals different mv which equals high es which doesn't equal great vertical at a mile.

Necks that are not straight or uniform will cause problems with neck tension and so on.

Case in point. My buddy shot a 65 PRC with factory 147 into one hole at 100 yards but couldn't manage the vertical at a mile to even get on target. Was the brass the only reason, probably not but it probably didn't help. Everything matters at a mile.
There are lots of reports out of people getting low ES and SD numbers from Hornady factory ammo. Again, if you're not reloading, I'm not sure what else you can expect. You can pay 90.00 a box for 300 Norma ammo, but who knows if it's any better.
 
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In factory fodder you have to give hornady credit. Their ammo will surprise alot of people. In my creed 140amx was shooting into the .3s with an es of 14. In the 308 178's are shooting .4 or better and es if 16. It shoots right along with fggm 175's same speeds and you can interchange them and stll keep the groups the same. I've shot some 270 superformance in the past with sub moa performance.
I'd expect the 300prc boxed ammo to perform at this level in an accurate rifle. If it's like the creed they built the ammo to perform in the sammi chamber like peanut butter and jelly
 
Likes: dfp dfp
Sep 10, 2017
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Yes, range report required! I just got word that my Proof barrel in 300 PRC is shipping, now to order my chassis and decide on a trigger for the Nucleus action I'll be screwing the barrel into! It will probably go into a KRG Bravo long action, as they take CIP length mags.
Is Proof doing pre-fits in the PRC already? or did you buy blank and have it chambered?

Get a TriggerTech special. I decided to splurge for one and I'm really glad i did.
 

Magoo124

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Dec 19, 2018
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Had anyone had any luck on load data? I emailed Hornady last week and they said they are working on load data and it should be on the website when they get it done. It would be nice for some parameters for safety reasons. Especially for the 212's and 225's. Safe powders, coals....ect. hopefully have my rifle ready to roll next month.