Three Neo-Nazis Arrested Heading to Richmond

Blutroop

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Isn’t it physically impossible for a single barrel gun to “fire more than one bullet at a time”?
mans if they intended to say full auto there are still devices (besides bump stocks) that are legal which allow a full auto effect. They are just trying to make a example and give Media something to blow out of proportion..
 

DarnYankeeUSMC

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Isn’t it physically impossible for a single barrel gun to “fire more than one bullet at a time”?
mans if they intended to say full auto there are still devices (besides bump stocks) that are legal which allow a full auto effect. They are just trying to make a example and give Media something to blow out of proportion..
I bet that they did make a full auto AR. But the wording used by FBI agents in that file is terrible.
"Assault rifle" I guess he's trying to say full auto?
And two bullets at one time? Jeez you would think that Brian Williams wrote that POS
 

Skunk

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Keep in mind the agent is swearing to a Judge that everything in that Complaint is true and correct to the best of his knowledge. If the agent didn't fire the weapon himself, he will have a hard time swearing to the fact the weapon fires more than one bullet per trigger press. He can't swear to it being a machine-gun...

Or, maybe it's just that FBI agents know as much about machine-guns as forum dwellers know about FISA.
 
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Vamike9

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All I heard on the local news was they assembled an AR15, had 1600 rds of ammo and that's it?
What crime did they commit outside of being racist pieces of crap?
Just like all of us, they have the right to think however they like as long as they did not show intent on hurting someone.
My guess is that they threatened someone, and if they were found with a firearm, well there you have it...
 
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Blutroop

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All I heard on the local news was they assembled an AR15, had 1600 rds of ammo and that's it?
What crime did they commit outside of being racist pieces of crap?
Just like all of us, they have the right to think however they like as long as they did not show intent on hurting someone.
My guess is that they threatened someone, and if they were found with a firearm, well there you have it...
And when they say threatened, I bet they probably just said something like you can have my gun when you pry it from my cold dead hand..
 

lawofsavage

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Keep in mind the agent is swearing to a Judge that everything in that Complaint is true and correct to the best of his knowledge. If the agent didn't fire the weapon himself, he will have a hard time swearing to the fact the weapon fires more than one bullet per trigger press. He can't swear to it being a machine-gun...

Or, maybe it's just that FBI agents know as much about machine-guns as forum dwellers know about FISA.
What makes you think the complaints and warrants in the cases being discussed in this thread have anything to do with FISA?

What's the difference between:

representing something to be true when you know its not true

vs

representing something to be true when you don't know if it's true or not true?
 

Skunk

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It was a joke... Never mind.

One is a lie and the other is a "reasonable belief." In this case, backed up by the quoted admissions of the defendants as written in paragraph 18.
 

lawofsavage

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It was a joke... Never mind.

One is a lie and the other is a "reasonable belief." In this case, backed up by the quoted admissions of the defendants as written in paragraph 18.
lol

always trying to learn, what in your opinion based on the complaint and warrant being discussed in this thread provides support sufficient to establish a "reasonable belief" that the offense of "transporting firearm and ammunition in interstate commerce with intent to commit therewith an offense punishable by a term exceeding one year" was committed?
 

Skunk

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lol

always trying to learn, what in your opinion based on the complaint and warrant being discussed in this thread provides support sufficient to establish a "reasonable belief" that the offense of "transporting firearm and ammunition in interstate commerce with intent to commit therewith an offense punishable by a term exceeding one year" was committed?
The complaint details numerous trips back and forth between Delaware and Maryland, to and from a gun range, to fire a weapon they knew and believed to be a machine gun.
 

alpine44

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Guys, please.

What the FBI and other agencies do on the top level is one thing. There they know that hardly anyone will go after them.
Remember when Clapper (NSA) committed perjury on national television and nothing happened? Get caught with that in the lower courts and you are toast.

On the lower level, that we are discussing here, they know that even a public defender will gladly tear their case and them apart if possible.
 
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alpine44

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The complaint details numerous trips back and forth between Delaware and Maryland, to and from a gun range, to fire a weapon they knew and believed to be a machine gun.
Don't you need some ATF paperwork even for a legally registered machine gun to be transferred from one state to another?
 

lawofsavage

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The complaint details numerous trips back and forth between Delaware and Maryland, to and from a gun range, to fire a weapon they knew and believed to be a machine gun.
lol

based on my understanding which is admittedly very limited hahaha, there has to be at least an additional element of an offense that needs to be proven not to run afoul of double jeopardy principles and they were already charged with "transporting machine gun in interstate commerce" as a separate offense so still trying to learn but if I was steven crowder at a change my mind event my mind still wouldn't have been changed yet lol
 

Skunk

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I don't have a personal machine gun, but I imagine it would be treated the same as a suppressor when it comes to interstate transfer.

I'll have to read the statutes in their entirety to fully answer you. Maybe transporting the "machine gun in interstate commerce" is one offense and the firing of said weapon at the range is another.

I'm sure the affidavit for indictment will be more detailed....
 

Blutroop

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I’m gonna laugh my ass off if it turns out their “machine gun” was a bump stock
 

lawofsavage

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I don't have a personal machine gun, but I imagine it would be treated the same as a suppressor when it comes to interstate transfer.

I'll have to read the statutes in their entirety to fully answer you. Maybe transporting the "machine gun in interstate commerce" is one offense and the firing of said weapon at the range is another.

I'm sure the affidavit for indictment will be more detailed....
I'm not trying to argue with you at all that these guys sound like jackboots who it sounds like were crossing state lines with unlicensed nfa items ... no on knows for sure until more evidence is made public but I agree it sounds like they have their bases covered on that

where I as sort of going with all this is that the media is already playing up the idea that these guys were planning some sort of violent act

i just wanted to see if I was missing something in connection with an "intent to commit a crime" with the firearm they crossed the stateliness with as I am always willing to learn and i can always miss things but i just didn't see much of anything in the way of support for any intent to commit crimes with firearms other than what they were already charged with which was crossing state lines with nfa items
 
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Skunk

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I gotcha.

I agree with your assessment of the media. They're just itching to paint a rally/protest in support of the 2A as a meeting place for racist, white, gun-toting criminals when in fact these idiots that were arrested may have had no connection to it whatsoever.

"Intent to commit a crime with a firearm" could mean kill a bunch of people at a rally or rob a liquor store.
 

Fig

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I don’t trust the government much either, but I can honestly say that of the few groups of people I trust less, ISIS, Alqueda, Communists, socialists, ANTIFA,...Nazis are certainly among them and rate a decisive FU.
 

RyanScott

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Keep in mind the agent is swearing to a Judge that everything in that Complaint is true and correct to the best of his knowledge. If the agent didn't fire the weapon himself, he will have a hard time swearing to the fact the weapon fires more than one bullet per trigger press. He can't swear to it being a machine-gun...

Or, maybe it's just that FBI agents know as much about machine-guns as forum dwellers know about FISA.
You don’t have to fire a weapon to determine its automatic. You can function test it by dry firing.
I don't have a personal machine gun, but I imagine it would be treated the same as a suppressor when it comes to interstate transfer.

I'll have to read the statutes in their entirety to fully answer you. Maybe transporting the "machine gun in interstate commerce" is one offense and the firing of said weapon at the range is another.

I'm sure the affidavit for indictment will be more detailed....
I like suppressors you need to request permission to travel interstate with a form 5320.20.
 

nso123

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This was just on our local news. Sounds like they were going to off some ANTIFA thugs.
 

Skunk

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You don’t have to fire a weapon to determine its automatic. You can function test it by dry firing.

I like suppressors you need to request permission to travel interstate with a form 5320.20.
Yes, you can function test. But, and I'm probably not a pro at this, you probably wouldn't want to approach the bad guys at the range and say, "hello, gents. May I please function test your weapon to determine whether or not it's automatic so I can go write a complaint and swear out a warrant on you?"

Do you need to complete the 5320 to travel out of state for a short trip, or only permanent transfer of location?
 

deersniper

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I don't have a personal machine gun, but I imagine it would be treated the same as a suppressor when it comes to interstate transfer.

I'll have to read the statutes in their entirety to fully answer you. Maybe transporting the "machine gun in interstate commerce" is one offense and the firing of said weapon at the range is another.

I'm sure the affidavit for indictment will be more detailed....
You have to fill out some bs form before you move machine guns or sbrs across state lines. Don’t need that to move silencers