Shooting with a level

4dds

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I put a level on my gun recently and was wondering how long it took you to get used to using one. It seems I cant the rifle check the level get it level then back on target and re level. It’s just making me extremely slow between shots.
 
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GotCox

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That is the point of a level. Took me well over 300 rounds before i started to get quick with on target and leveled up. I am sure after this learning experience i have always shot my guns canted to the right by 10-15* without knowing it.
 
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ScottDWallace

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I adapted to it after one trip to the range. The MPA chassis level is in such a convenient place, that it is natural to give it a glance without ever breaking your cheekweld.
 

A&8's

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I adapted to it after one trip to the range. The MPA chassis level is in such a convenient place, that it is natural to give it a glance without ever breaking your cheekweld.
I agree. I also like the black pea indicator on white background vs the clear air bubble. Next best thing, IMO, is the location on spuhr mounts. If they'd put the black indicator on it.
 

Steel head

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I always can kinda see it with my left eye.
It’s taught me that I tend to have the rifle canted slightly clockwise.

On my 260 I just always remember my can’t tendencies and don’t run a level anymore.

On my 7mm I get set up and check the level, make adjustments if needed then lock the bipod down.
 

Jack Master

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It took me about 100 rounds to really get used to it.

If this is a persistent problem, in my opinion, is when the level is not setup for you (notice I didn't say "the rifle"). Maybe you naturally cant the rifle a bit when you have the rifle in your shoulder with your natural point of Aim, and that is okay. You may need to rotate your scope to be level with gravity when you are on the rifle rather than the scope being level with the rifle. Having your rifle set up as the picture below is an okay thing and will help you remove cant from your Natural shooting position. I've done this on a few rifles and it made a world of difference for quicker shots. All my P-dog rifles are set up this way. Doing this an switching to weak side shooting can be more difficult.

This rifle setup is okay. This fits the shooter.
 

Rocketmandb

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I check cant only for the first shot of a string, then forget about it for the rest unless I do a position reset of some sort. I just don't get enough (any) movement between shots.

Questions:

- What caliber(s) are you shooting?
- What bipod are you using?
- Do you use brake(s)?
 

4dds

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I check cant only for the first shot of a string, then forget about it for the rest unless I do a position reset of some sort. I just don't get enough (any) movement between shots.

Questions:

- What caliber(s) are you shooting?
- What bipod are you using?
- Do you use brake(s)?
The level is on my 6.5 creedmoor with a Caldwell bipod and a pva brake. It’s the only rifle I’ve ever put a level on and found that after settling on target and then checking it seemed I was always canted to the left to some degree. Then I would level the gun be off target get back on target have to relevel. It was taking 5-10 seconds each shot to get level and on target. The off level between shots during a string was way less than when I would initially set up. I probably need to put one on my 22 trainer to practice with.
 

BLKWLFK9

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The level is on my 6.5 creedmoor with a Caldwell bipod and a pva brake. It’s the only rifle I’ve ever put a level on and found that after settling on target and then checking it seemed I was always canted to the left to some degree. Then I would level the gun be off target get back on target have to relevel. It was taking 5-10 seconds each shot to get level and on target. The off level between shots during a string was way less than when I would initially set up. I probably need to put one on my 22 trainer to practice with.

thats your problem. get a quality bipod and there will be less times you need to correct the cant of your rifle. the Caldwell is the culprit for the frequency of canting.
 
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Rocketmandb

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The level is on my 6.5 creedmoor with a Caldwell bipod and a pva brake. It’s the only rifle I’ve ever put a level on and found that after settling on target and then checking it seemed I was always canted to the left to some degree. Then I would level the gun be off target get back on target have to relevel. It was taking 5-10 seconds each shot to get level and on target. The off level between shots during a string was way less than when I would initially set up. I probably need to put one on my 22 trainer to practice with.
A 6.5 CM with a brake should not be generating enough recoil to force you off cant between shots due to minor errors in positioning or something inherent in the rifle. Possible culprits:

- You are positioned inappropriately behind the rifle which causes it to cant during recoil. I show exactly this phenomenon happening in one of my videos - pretty darned clear what's happening in it.
- The bipod isn't locked down well enough against cant, meaning a small amount of angular momentum allows it to move off level.
- You have too hard of a shoulder which reflects too much recoil back into the rifle, which would exacerbate either of the above two.
- Your brake isn't timed appropriately, causing the rifle to rotate - though it would take a lot. Worth checking on, but probably not the only culprit, even if it exists.

Also, as to training with your 22, that's the opposite way you want to go. Go bigger, and if you don't have bigger, find a friend who does and ask to shoot it. The reason being that the 22's low recoil will hide poor technique, causing you to actually get sloppier. Calibers with more recoil will cause issues with your technique to be more pronounced, showing you where you need work.
 

4dds

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thats your problem. get a quality bipod and there will be less times you need to correct the cant of your rifle. the Caldwell is the culprit for the frequency of canting.
Not trying to be a smartass here but what about the bipod makes it bad. Just wondering why you feel it’s the culprit



A 6.5 CM with a brake should not be generating enough recoil to force you off cant between shots due to minor errors in positioning or something inherent in the rifle. Possible culprits:

- You are positioned inappropriately behind the rifle which causes it to cant during recoil. I show exactly this phenomenon happening in one of my videos - pretty darned clear what's happening in it.
- The bipod isn't locked down well enough against cant, meaning a small amount of angular momentum allows it to move off level.
- You have too hard of a shoulder which reflects too much recoil back into the rifle, which would exacerbate either of the above two.
- Your brake isn't timed appropriately, causing the rifle to rotate - though it would take a lot. Worth checking on, but probably not the only culprit, even if it exists.

Also, as to training with your 22, that's the opposite way you want to go. Go bigger, and if you don't have bigger, find a friend who does and ask to shoot it. The reason being that the 22's low recoil will hide poor technique, causing you to actually get sloppier. Calibers with more recoil will cause issues with your technique to be more pronounced, showing you where you need work.
The biggest issue isn’t between shots so much as initial set up. Between shots I usually stay within half a bubble.
- I usually do blade off from habits I’m attempting to break. Going to have to go back and rewatch the videos.
 

wade2big

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I put a level on my gun recently and was wondering how long it took you to get used to using one. It seems I cant the rifle check the level get it level then back on target and re level. It’s just making me extremely slow between shots.
Has it made a positive difference in your shooting results? I know it is making a negative impact in your shooting experience it seems. Is it worth it?
 

2aBaCa

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Mine sits at about 8 o'clock on my scope and when shooting both eyes open it overlays in the top of my scope view as if it was inside my scope.

I dont understand why scope manufactures cant put a level inside the scope.
 

BLKWLFK9

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Not trying to be a smartass here but what about the bipod makes it bad. Just wondering why you feel it’s the culprit




The biggest issue isn’t between shots so much as initial set up. Between shots I usually stay within half a bubble.
- I usually do blade off from habits I’m attempting to break. Going to have to go back and rewatch the videos.
The ease of the bipod to cant due to recoil and the movement of manipulating the bolt and pressure from your face. Even pulling the trigger.
 
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Rocketmandb

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Not trying to be a smartass here but what about the bipod makes it bad. Just wondering why you feel it’s the culprit
I know you weren't responding to me in this, but I'll answer. Before I got my first Atlas bipod I had similar issues getting lined up - and the previous bipod was from a pretty reputable company. The canting mechanism is night and day. The Atlas has a very progressive tightening mechanism, so I can easily get it mostly tight, then rotate it without loosening. Before I got it: frustrating. After: I hardly think about it.

I know an Atlas (or other quality bipod) is expensive, but there is a reason for that.
 
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Rocketmandb

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I dont understand why scope manufactures cant put a level inside the scope.
There's more to it than just putting a level inside - you then also have to make sure the reticle is perfectly aligned. In many scopes they aren't. That's why you should level with a lubber line and not by putting a separate bubble level on top of the turret. Level = cost. Perfect reticle alignment = cost. Then what about the people who don't want to pay extra for it because they don't like the interior level?
 
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4dds

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Has it made a positive difference in your shooting results? I know it is making a negative impact in your shooting experience it seems. Is it worth it?
I don’t feel like 20 rounds is enough to make a decision as to how it is affecting me. Time will tell.
 

4dds

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And now I have spent the evening tinkering with the bipod. The pan feature is locked down solid and the cant now takes some force to move. Much different from it falling off to the side with little to no pressure. I will play with this some and see if it helps.
 

goneballistic

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There's more to it than just putting a level inside - you then also have to make sure the reticle is perfectly aligned. In many scopes they aren't. That's why you should level with a lubber line and not by putting a separate bubble level on top of the turret. Level = cost. Perfect reticle alignment = cost. Then what about the people who don't want to pay extra for it because they don't like the interior level?

There is something weird about me, when my reticle is perfectly leveled, it looks way off to me. To everyone else, it looks perfect, but to me it looks tilted about 5 degrees.

I have to use a level or i'd always be canted.

Give it some time op, you'll get very fast eventually, and your body will learn what correct is and you'll start setting up level then very fast to check
 
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Steel head

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There is something weird about me, when my reticle is perfectly leveled, it looks way off to me. To everyone else, it looks perfect, but to me it looks tilted about 5 degrees.

I have to use a level or i'd always be canted.

Give it some time op, you'll get very fast eventually, and your body will learn what correct is and you'll start setting up level then very fast to check
I’m the same way.
Using a level on my 260 it taught me to cant the reticle a bit from my perceived vertical and now I don’t bother with a level on it anymore.
 

4dds

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After modifying the bipod it did make a huge difference shot to shot. I still had to get straightened up initially but after that it would stay until I came off the gun. I did shoot some barricade and I seemed to set up level better than prone.