PVA Status Updates: Hancock Rifle & NUCLEUS Barreled Action

hereinaz

I have no idea why I get these new labels...
Hessian
Online Training Access
Belligerents
Minuteman
Mar 7, 2018
505
352
69
Arizona
While the news of the email is good, I have chosen to temper my excitement. It's still single source/unverified info at this point. There are a boat load of us that ordered within 24 hours of the opening that haven't been emailed. There may have been an issue with that individual's order.... who knows?
I ordered before 11:00 am on the first day. Also, I ordered a short action and long action. I only got notification on my short action.

I'm hoping they start rolling off the production line.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Squatch245

flyer

Major Hide Member
Belligerents
Minuteman
Apr 25, 2018
1,289
586
119
Well that puts me probably about 400 behind.

If the batches are 50 actions, I'll be batch 9-10 (calling PVA's order #1).
 

character0

Private
Belligerents
Aug 3, 2017
54
44
24
Well that puts me probably about 400 behind.

If the batches are 50 actions, I'll be batch 9-10 (calling PVA's order #1).
All speculation here, but hey, since we apparently can't help but speculate....

ARC order numbers aren't all solely nucleus actions. As Josh stated earlier in this thread, the John Hancock Rifle actions are awaiting variance marking approval through BATFE. This lends me to believe Ted/ARC has completed all of the initial JHR earmarked receivers and is now moving on to other vendors/individual orders. The post above with an invoice supports this theory, and as a business if ARC isn't processing/cutting/moving product they're wasting time/money, so it would be a logical next step. I'm guessing we'll start seeing Nucleus actions going out that are not dependent on the marking variance. This also jives with Josh's updates suggesting early June.

All that said, I'm excited for both ARC and PVA to have this finally coming to market. I'm sure they're starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel, but there's still much work to be done.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MLC and lash

Ericsl2

No longer private!
Belligerents
Feb 18, 2017
680
195
69
Albuquerque, nm
Why do you insist on pulling random numbers out of wherever you are pulling them from?
You get so heated on this thread. Just relax. All this speculation is at least giving me something to read throughout the day! I'm anxious.. Really anxious but I know it's going to get here when it gets here. Also, how you like that bergara? Found one local and they seem to be really nice
 

lash

Swamp Rat
Belligerents
Sep 28, 2012
3,866
1,780
219
60
Central Florida
You get so heated on this thread. Just relax. All this speculation is at least giving me something to read throughout the day! I'm anxious.. Really anxious but I know it's going to get here when it gets here. Also, how you like that bergara? Found one local and they seem to be really nice
I do not own a bergera, but often run a long range practice locally and watched a guy with his first long range rifle, a bergera, make consistent hits out to 1000 yards. I was frankly impressed with the whole package.
 

Winny94

Sergeant
Belligerents
Nov 19, 2013
877
250
89
You get so heated on this thread. Just relax. All this speculation is at least giving me something to read throughout the day! I'm anxious.. Really anxious but I know it's going to get here when it gets here. Also, how you like that bergara? Found one local and they seem to be really nice
I'm not heated, just confused why the same poster refuses to listen to anyone and keeps throwing out random numbers that just keep adding to confusion.

I dropped it in an MPA, and I was impressed by the slickness of the bolt. I'm hoping to get it to the range this weekend, but weather ain't looking great. Tonight I'm mounting up the Kahles on an Area 419 rail (which is a beautiful rail). I'm half-assed concerned I'll end up holding the bergara on par with the ARC haha
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bradu and Ericsl2

Bradu

Full Member
Belligerents
Aug 24, 2011
2,249
410
189
IL
Why do you insist on pulling random numbers out of wherever you are pulling them from?
I merely come here for the entertainment lol. We all know that having a rifle built is dependent on parts and usually when something new is introduced there are almost always delays. It sucks but it's part of it. I'm sure that ARC and PVA are doing everything they can to get the product to the customers as soon as possible. They want the product out to you guys just as bad because that's how they make their money. Not to mention, they want to keep everyone happy.
 

j741

Hide Member
Belligerents
Sep 10, 2017
724
219
49
Greater Seattle Area
so, do folks intend to ditch the Bravo chassis right away and migrate to something else?
I just ordered the barreled action. Saves time and effort of selling the bravo chassis. If one isn’t concerned about PRS class and doesn’t want Bravo then no reason to buy JHR over barreled action.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jhayesvw

hereinaz

I have no idea why I get these new labels...
Hessian
Online Training Access
Belligerents
Minuteman
Mar 7, 2018
505
352
69
Arizona
While the news of the email is good, I have chosen to temper my excitement. It's still single source/unverified info at this point. There are a boat load of us that ordered within 24 hours of the opening that haven't been emailed. There may have been an issue with that individual's order.... who knows?
I'm the guy that got the email. Until I see it in my hands, and others getting the email, believe me, I am being honest and limited about my expectations... especially if I am the only dude who got an email.

And, it is kinda fun to stir the pot a little bit. But, don't take that as a sign I made it up, LOL.

I'll be back with updates. I know why I kept coming back to this thread!
 

jgs8163

Private
Belligerents
Jan 23, 2014
171
99
34
Southern AZ
Will probably give PRS Production Class a try, Thinking a Razor HD Gen 1 for glass.
I have a brand new Gen 1 MOA I may want to part with. Bought for a different build and never mounted or used it. Sitting in my safe.
 
Last edited:

BoilerUP

Gunny Sergeant
Belligerents
Jan 16, 2011
2,812
251
189
35
Clark Co., IN
RFutch said:
My barrel shipped today!!!

Thank you PVA and Josh! I'll stop bothering you now.:)
How's your 223 barrel shoot? I'm at 19+ weeks and waiting for my PVA 223 prefit barrel after being told they'd be done with it last week, and then this week, now told next week...:cry:
 

RFutch

Sergeant
Belligerents
Sep 28, 2010
722
105
49
37
Chattanooga, TN
How's your 223 barrel shoot? I'm at 19+ weeks and waiting for my PVA 223 prefit barrel after being told they'd be done with it last week, and then this week, now told next week...:cry:
My 223 is a Criterion and it shoots in the .4's.

The PVA I got is 6.5x47L but I haven't been able to shoot it yet. It's installed on my action just waiting for my McMillan to get back from CDI. I would have it all together by now but I waited like a dummy to send it to him and he had a back log as well.

Hang in there man, it should be worth it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tihz_on

BoilerUP

Gunny Sergeant
Belligerents
Jan 16, 2011
2,812
251
189
35
Clark Co., IN
Thanks for the reply...for some reason I thought your prefit was a 223.

I certainly understand 'stuff happens' and nothing is ever ready when we want it (yesterday)...but I said upthread, I can be an impatient bastard and its tough having missed the entire spring shooting season.

PPPPPP on my part...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jhayesvw

spife7980

Luchador
Belligerents
Feb 10, 2017
4,893
1,877
119
Central TX
How's your 223 barrel shoot? I'm at 19+ weeks and waiting for my PVA 223 prefit barrel after being told they'd be done with it last week, and then this week, now told next week...:cry:
Im at 18+ weeks for my 223.
I wish I hadnt said "I dont mind the additional lead time" though I was under the assumption that it would be a few weeks as opposed to months because it seemed others on the forum were getting their stuff in a week or two tops when I ordered.
Then I got excited when a bunch of 223 tubes were getting cut a couple weeks ago about the same time that the guy cancelled his order and got bitched out on here. Turns out were building new tripods now and not barrels. Oh well... the wait continues.
 
  • Like
Reactions: stereo.pete

BoilerUP

Gunny Sergeant
Belligerents
Jan 16, 2011
2,812
251
189
35
Clark Co., IN
Yea, I really don't want to be "that guy", an impatient bitch customer whining about wait times that constantly needs progress updates and takes employees away from making chips.

Like most impatient bastards, I want my stuff yesterday but 100% understand quality can't be rushed and I'm totally willing to wait for a top-notch product. I also know PVA has their hands full with a couple dozen different balls in the air.

It is just a wee bit frustrating to be told one thing and not have it come to fruition, then have that cycle repeat a couple more times. Had I known it'd take THIS long for a prefit barrel, I'd likely have gone a different route.

Its almost worse than waiting for a stamp...oh well...
 

lash

Swamp Rat
Belligerents
Sep 28, 2012
3,866
1,780
219
60
Central Florida
From my perspective, this whole delay was a careful plan to support the firearms industry. (Totally joking about in case anyone is wont to take it otherwise)

But seriously, I'm starting a slow build on a .224 Valkyrie due to the delay. And I mean, it is a slow build. Even so, I believe I may finish this first.

I'm truly not in a hurry as I am lucky enough to have a rifle or so to keep me shooting in the meantime.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jhayesvw

jgs8163

Private
Belligerents
Jan 23, 2014
171
99
34
Southern AZ
Yea, I really don't want to be "that guy", an impatient bitch customer whining about wait times that constantly needs progress updates and takes employees away from making chips.

Like most impatient bastards, I want my stuff yesterday but 100% understand quality can't be rushed and I'm totally willing to wait for a top-notch product. I also know PVA has their hands full with a couple dozen different balls in the air.

It is just a wee bit frustrating to be told one thing and not have it come to fruition, then have that cycle repeat a couple more times. Had I known it'd take THIS long for a prefit barrel, I'd likely have gone a different route.

Its almost worse than waiting for a stamp...oh well...
Sounds to me like you’ve become, “that guy”!
 

7mm08mate

Private
Minuteman
Jun 14, 2018
5
3
6
The ARC mag has an internal length of 2.96-ish as I recall.
The Nucleus prototype that's in my hands, currently built into a production-intent JHR, it feeds 2.95" COAL 308's without a problem.



Before there is a flurry of speculation here is what "production intent" means


Production Intent is a prototype that is made on

Production Tooling/Workholding/Machinery
Production raw materials (barrel blanks, triggers, stocks, etc)
Production Artwork
Production Packaging
etc

It is, for all intents, a production component but it isn't being sold. It's a T&E for internal review.

We have a Production Intent JHR.

Production barrel blank - check
Production barrel cutting process - check
Production Contour/Chambering/Threading/etc - check
Production stock - check
Production trigger - check
Production Brake - check
Production engraving - check

Production Action - No, we have a pre-production prototype.

We have exactly 1 prototype.
There are exactly 3 prototypes in existence
We have 1
SAC has 1
ARC has 1

That's it.

People have seen them, handled them at SHOT, and some folks have gotten to shoot them when they happen to bump into myself, Ted, or Mark Gordon when one of us happened to be doing test work.


The JHR that I'm taking to the ELR match in 10 days is the production intent gun.
It's a production barrel, trigger, stock, scope, rings, brake, etc. EVERYTHING except the action is a production part and if someone needed it I could take it all apart and hand them everything except the action. It would screw together into a JHR.

But... because of the Marking Variance not being approved yet we do not have clearance by the ATF to allow ARC to laser the JHR logos and markings on the receiver bodies. They're done, sitting at ARC's shop awaiting laser, then nitride, then they come to PVA. Until we get through the milestone of the the marking variance being approved then the PVA work route is to keep knocking out barrels and writing the details with a sharpie.

Once we have a production action in place we will do final fit for clocking and start burning the laser work on the barrels.

The entire world will know when the marking variance comes through, trust me, it will be in the news. Until then, there's no such thing as an estimated date on when the paperwork will come back.
Bohem, How did the JHR (Nucleus) run at the NF ELR match. I had some friends of mine shoot in it and they had heard that it had some extraction issues or something to that effect. what was your experience?
 

BLKWLFK9

come at me bro
Online Training Access
Belligerents
Feb 13, 2017
812
627
99
greenville, NC
Bohem, How did the JHR (Nucleus) run at the NF ELR match. I had some friends of mine shoot in it and they had heard that it had some extraction issues or something to that effect. what was your experience?
Josh didn't have any extraction issues at all. He had a failure to fire due to a faulty firing pin spring that was in his prototype. The production actions have the new spring in them already. Josh replaced the faulty prototype spring and had 0 further issues. It wasn't ejecting loaded rounds bc he was using ammo loaded to 3.331 COAL which is around .4" longer than an AW mag. There will be no issues with extraction in the least.
 

jbailey

Gunny Sergeant
Belligerents
Jul 27, 2010
1,591
129
169
45
Arlington VA
Did you guys hear he went 4/4 on a 75% elk target at 1591yds in 25-29mph wind in the match? This is with a 308 24" barrel on short action. The day before he had hits at 2100yds. Now its with his 198gr Flatline bullets, so your 175gr SMK mileage may vary. Nevertheless, the rifle pounds steel a long ways out.
 

bohem

PVA's HMFIC
Commercial Supporter
Belligerents
Jan 6, 2009
7,327
997
219
Southeast, PA
www.patriotvalleyarms.com
Bohem, How did the JHR (Nucleus) run at the NF ELR match. I had some friends of mine shoot in it and they had heard that it had some extraction issues or something to that effect. what was your experience?

The prototype action (we are still running SN# EXP-00002) had fail to fire issues from a mainspring that is bad. It was a known problem on the prototypes that were hurried together for SHOT, but since I didn't have a production action due to the delay on our Marking Variance I took the prototype to the match and the 1-off spring in it gave up the ghost.

That spawns a series of other issues.

I was using Flatlines loaded way too long for the port (3.3+" long) so they won't eject a loaded round at that length. In a push-feed, spring ejector action you can pull the bolt to pull a long round. In a mechanical ejector action you can't do that because the bolt stroke actuates the ejector. So you have to snap the case head out of the extractor and push it down through the magwell.

The extractor on the Nucleus is no joke, it's a 2 stage CRF that grabs TIGHT. So, in match conditions the fastest way for me to snap the unfired cartridge out of the action and load a new one was to use my pocketknife as a screwdriver and snap it down. It can be done with fingers but it's faster with a tool of some sort.

The Hancock configuration was solid though. There were no extractor issues whatsoever and the ejection was perfect with a fired case. The only issue came from unfired stuff as described above.

In terms of accuracy the rifle is "hole in hole" at short ranges and I was making regular hits on a 12" square at 1717yd on Friday. That's appx 0.6moa target at nearly a mile with a 308 in winds that were sustained above 18mph.

During the ELR WR Attempt and the match I had repeated hits past 1500 as well as dead center hits at 1800 and 2096yd.
 

bohem

PVA's HMFIC
Commercial Supporter
Belligerents
Jan 6, 2009
7,327
997
219
Southeast, PA
www.patriotvalleyarms.com
What's the story behind the 19 weeks lead time
We ran out of 22 cal blanks that had the right twist rate and contour for what those customers ordered.

As I've said in other threads, perhaps this one as well, we started contouring in house about 6 weeks ago because our suppliers were having a hard time keeping up with all the contours and delivery schedule. Once we went to contouring in house it allowed us to catch up a lot on those orders.


For the Nucleus Group Buy barrels we've been waiting a clocking artifact for marking the barrels. I have them cut, lined up and waiting for laser work. As soon as the artifact gets here from ARC we can laser and ship those barrels out to the customers.
 

spife7980

Luchador
Belligerents
Feb 10, 2017
4,893
1,877
119
Central TX
This thread always delivers!!! 19 weeks on a barrel is absolutely unacceptable by anyones standards.
What's the story behind the 19 weeks lead time
I was a bit perturbed by the lead time but to be completely fair, I signed on for it. So I have no leg to stand on getting salty. It was never mentioned that it was going to be a short wait. Just hoped it would.

Last Friday I sent an email asking when I could expect to see it and got a prompt reply that

"It's just waiting on lasering and I don't know how to run the new laser yet. It will go out early next week when Josh gets back from an ELR match.

We had issues with getting in 22 cal blanks until a couple of weeks ago and had a huge batch to run because everyone wants 223 trainers this year. I went ahead and refunded $50 since you, and a few others with 223 orders, had to wait a little while longer than planned. Again sorry for the delay. Have a great weekend!

Thanks,
Jeremy"


So they are aware and trying to make it right as fast as they can Im sure. I havent gotten the credit back to my account but honestly if it ships this week I couldn't care less about the 50 bucks. If it performs like the others results on the forum indicate it should Ill be tickled pink.

If it were on the shelf waiting to ship I guess it would no longer be custom, you know?
 
Last edited:

V-Ref

Sergeant
Belligerents
Jul 28, 2008
287
62
34
Eagle River, Alaska
Mammoth, welcome to SH. There's a lot to be learned here, there's also a ton of hype and misinformation/blind leading the blind here too, as the precision shooting market explodes.

That was a sarcastic post, your right.

Anyone that has shot ELR realizes the accomplishments posted aren't easy feats, and take time/dedication to make happen.

Anyone that's been waiting 5 months for a .223 barrel is likely disappointed to read on efforts other than products/services they've been waiting on.

At least the commo is there for guys waiting.
 

Winny94

Sergeant
Belligerents
Nov 19, 2013
877
250
89
I was a bit perturbed by the lead time but to be completely fair, I signed on for it. So I have no leg to stand on getting salty. It was never mentioned that it was going to be a short wait. Just hoped it would.

Last Friday I sent an email asking when I could expect to see it and got a prompt reply that

"It's just waiting on lasering and I don't know how to run the new laser yet. It will go out early next week when Josh gets back from an ELR match.

We had issues with getting in 22 cal blanks until a couple of weeks ago and had a huge batch to run because everyone wants 223 trainers this year. I went ahead and refunded $50 since you, and a few others with 223 orders, had to wait a little while longer than planned. Again sorry for the delay. Have a great weekend!

Thanks,
Jeremy"


So they are aware and trying to make it right as fast as they can Im sure. I havent gotten the credit back to my account but honestly if it ships this week I could care less about the 50 bucks. If it performs like the others results on the forum indicate it should Ill be tickled pink.

If it were on the shelf waiting to ship I guess it would no longer be custom, you know?
How much less could you care? ;)

sorry, just a pet peeve
 
  • Like
Reactions: spife7980

Xander3Zero

Just a normal dude.
Belligerents
Aug 10, 2017
449
180
49
Rhode Island
Not trying to clog up this thread or throw it off track (as if it is still on track lol), but I am just curious about PVA's new endeavor with tripods... Is PVA making these in-house? Perhaps out sourcing the carbon fiber legs and other components? Seems like a real branch out from making custom rifles, and now production rifles; I can only imagine how busy they must be.
 

b6graham

not a private
Belligerents
Jul 29, 2014
1,429
830
219
If they can do it for half the price why not? The tripod isn't the first thing they have taken and slashed the price on in the industry
 

MElank

Private
Belligerents
Apr 23, 2014
98
27
34
Oviedo, Florida
I don’t think anyone is mad about the tripod. The timing doesn’t seem great when people are waiting 20+ weeks for barrels, I think that’s the main issue.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Forward543

b6graham

not a private
Belligerents
Jul 29, 2014
1,429
830
219
I don’t think anyone is mad about the tripod. The timing doesn’t seem great when people are waiting 20+ weeks for barrels, I think that’s the main issue.
That was explained and understandable. It sucks yeah but we're 2 months plus behind on actions and its whatever at this point they'll come when they come.

If companies were waiting until they were caught up on all orders we would never see innovation (Manners)

There's only so much PVA can do on their machines while they wait for a timing artifact. For all we know this was in the works before SHOT and they waited and waited to announce
 

MElank

Private
Belligerents
Apr 23, 2014
98
27
34
Oviedo, Florida
Agreed. Things like that take a considerable amount of time.

I think I would have waited until after the nucleus barrels and any other outstanding long lead work was completed before I took more preorders for another entirely new product. But, that’s just me and I’m sure I don’t know the entire situation no one does but them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jhayesvw

TheMammoth

Overton goes Right
Hessian
Online Training Access
Belligerents
Feb 14, 2017
502
484
69
Mammoth, welcome to SH. There's a lot to be learned here, there's also a ton of hype and misinformation/blind leading the blind here too, as the precision shooting market explodes.

That was a sarcastic post, your right.

Anyone that has shot ELR realizes the accomplishments posted aren't easy feats, and take time/dedication to make happen.

Anyone that's been waiting 5 months for a .223 barrel is likely disappointed to read on efforts other than products/services they've been waiting on.

At least the commo is there for guys waiting.
Yeah you’re right. While he’s waiting for actions/artifacts etc to show up he should chain himself to the heat register and water fast so you’re satisfied.

I know my rifle is late, he’s been honest as to why. I was happy to see his results and I’ve been waiting since day one for the rifle.

Crush up a Xanax, snort it, watch Scooby-Doo and get some sleep, fella.
 

b6graham

not a private
Belligerents
Jul 29, 2014
1,429
830
219
Yeah you’re right. While he’s waiting for actions/artifacts etc to show up he should chain himself to the heat register and water fast so you’re satisfied.

I know my rifle is late, he’s been honest as to why. I was happy to see his results and I’ve been waiting since day one for the rifle.

Crush up a Xanax, snort it, watch Scooby-Doo and get some sleep, fella.
You clearly don't understand how preorders work. They're supposed to only work on then and nothing else to build your (fairly new) business
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheMammoth