PVA Status Updates: Hancock Rifle & NUCLEUS Barreled Action

Apr 4, 2013
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Keep in mind, you may have ordered the very first Nucleus once is was announced to the public and yet you would still be over 3 months behind my first PO for actions. We (PVA) had to cut a PO to ARC for 50 actions to start, and 50 actions through the course of the year to even get the project from a collaborative thought experiment to reality.

I (We/PVA) have actually been on order for Nucleus actions for going on 9 months. We were first in line, longbefore you were. You didn't know about it because everything on the action was behind NDA. That's the way things go. There are no "keep it quiet but this is what we're doing" secrets in this industry. As soon as anyone gets a peep of anything it's blasted all over the place. So... there was no discussion about it whatsoever.
I totally get it. I just slipped through the cracks due to the unfortunate timing of trying to get in line right away. Can you clarify what you mean in bold above? Are you saying that if we ordered an action direct from ARC that we are still three months out? Thank you.
 
Likes: rymart
Jan 23, 2014
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Well how long is immediately?

Do you think he has them all there in a row and is just slapping on shipping labels?

That would be great but the way I read it, "immediately" means as soon as I can.

I'm still skeptical of one single batch for all pre SHOT orders.
As Josh stated above in a prior reply he does not have any production actions as of yet. All he has is the initial prototype and he’s waiting for his first batch of actions. That being said we just need to be patient and it’ll eventually all come together.
 
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Sergeant of the Hide
Jan 29, 2018
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Geez guys, stop beating the guy up already.

Its simple, PVA had a order in before ARC ever announced a damn thing. That puts PVA first in line for a given amount. After ARC meets that first order to PVA, they will start shipping based on their orders.

When all that will be depends on ARCs ability to produce and its completely out of PVAs hands.

Asking PVA when a ARC order will ship is dumb.

Knowing exactly when a PVA order will ship doesnt seem possible yet based on ATF and delivery schedule from ARC.

This is nothing more than wasting time asking foolish questions.
 

diverdon

Online Training Member
Dec 21, 2011
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You're not "behind" them. These are being batches produced - if you ordered before SHOT, you'll get yours in the first batch. PVA goes out first, but that doesn't guarantee the guys that ordered them will get them first. Admin work, payment speed, payment processing, shipping, local FFL hours will all affect final delivery, but it's not like JH guys are going to have theirs in hand for weeks without anyone getting a stripped action direct from ARC.

I thought I was impatient, but some of you guys are just ridiculous
Hold on just a second! If I recall Ted did initially something like "early orders might ship in June." So now that it is June we are not that out of line to start speculating about when we are going to get them.

As a matter of fact I emailed ARC today asking that very question.
 
Apr 4, 2013
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As a matter of fact I emailed ARC today asking that very question.
Cool, it would be nice to get an update from ARC. It's frustrating that the only updates we get are from a different company (and not Josh's responsibility). Let us know if Ted responds.
 
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steve123

Lt. Colonel
Mar 16, 2008
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Hey Steve, how would you compare the resistance to binding vs. a Bighorn TL3? That's the action I have most experience with, and although I love it, I did notice that it sometimes would bite a bit when the bolt was at the rear and being pushed forward with even a little upwards pressure.

I'm glad to hear the bolt lift is light. How does it compare to a standard Remington 700? About the same, a little lighter maybe? I'm assuming smoother no doubt.
At this point it's all from a first impression memory. I didn't have a chance to go side by side with a M700 when I played with the Nucleus that day. I did get to compare the Nucleus with a Mausingfield. I'm usually a 90 degree bolt throw fan, 60 degree feels weird to me, well the 72 degree on the Nucleus seemed just right, I liked it. If I were to opine using cars like we do around here, M700's being your regular run of the mil car, a Nucleus would be like a Porsche Boxster with it's almost telepathic steering and all those other "just right" attributes I've read about.

Sorry, I don't own a Bighorn and don't have any local friends that have one so I can't really make a comparison. Though from a feature stand point I've always wanted one and the ones I've played with felt smooth.

Nucleus - All I can say is that based off my memory it was a WOW first impression, an oh yeah, this is what I want for my next build, it checked all the boxes in the "this is what Steve prefers action cycling test" as far as the operation feel! It's mostly a subjective thing, one brand action to one guy might not give that 'ooh ahh' impression, they immediately start identifying personal yays or nays, just saying. Heck I have a certain nay with the Mausingfield that the Nucleus addressed, bolt opening feel, the Nucleus feels so much nicer to me, those dual cocking cams were a great idea.
 
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Sergeant of the Hide
Jan 29, 2018
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Hold on just a second! If I recall Ted did initially something like "early orders might ship in June." So now that it is June we are not that out of line to start speculating about when we are going to get them.

As a matter of fact I emailed ARC today asking that very question.
As previously stated ARC had issues with a vendor and subsequently had to purchase machinery to produce parts in house. These parts should have been in production prior to the announcement of the Nucleus action....

To me, that says at bare minimum ARC is at least a month and a half behind their original best case scenario release date. New tooling and man power doesn't come quick or cheap and a month plus of list production time isnt often made up while trying to reconfigure a production process for items that were planned to be outsourced.
 

Winny94

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Nov 19, 2013
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As previously stated ARC had issues with a vendor and subsequently had to purchase machinery to produce parts in house. These parts should have been in production prior to the announcement of the Nucleus action....

To me, that says at bare minimum ARC is at least a month and a half behind their original best case scenario release date. New tooling and man power doesn't come quick or cheap and a month plus of list production time isnt often made up while trying to reconfigure a production process for items that were planned to be outsourced.
If you recall, the initial release date was April. The Late May/ Early June release came after the screw production had been resolved.
 
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Sergeant of the Hide
Jan 29, 2018
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If you recall, the initial release date was April. The Late May/ Early June release came after the screw production had been resolved.
I recall April 16th perhaps? And I believe its was small parts and bolt face.... significantly more labor intensive than "screw"

Ask until your heart is content, it wont change the fact that I dont expect to see anything real for a significant amount of time and that's ok with me. I could have just bought a tikka and been out shooting already... this is my first and only centerfire bolt gun and I'd rather wait and get it right the first time.
 

flyer

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Apr 25, 2018
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I think in a post above, PVA said that was the first production John Hancock rifle which would mean ARC shipped some complete actions to PVA.

That's a milestone for sure but the wait is still going to be a while for people who didn't get in very early orders.
 

**DRB**

Sergeant of the Hide
Jan 29, 2018
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I think in a post above, PVA said that was the first production John Hancock rifle which would mean ARC shipped some complete actions to PVA.

That's a milestone for sure but the wait is still going to be a while for people who didn't get in very early orders.
That would be incorrect. That action was the prototype and not a production run action. The milestone was the finishing of the laser engraving process and now the wait for production actions to finish machining barrels based on final tolerances and spec.
 

MinnesotaMulisha

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Jul 30, 2013
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I think some of you need to be on anxiety meds. Chill out and wait. Regardless of what you say or how you interpret something to be said isn't going to get anything to your doorstep any quicker. Quit worrying about your order number, pre/post SHOT orders or whatever it is that has your undies in a bunch. If you didn't realize before you put your money down that there would be a wait, tough shit. Not everything always goes as planned. So it disrupts delivery dates. Get over it.
 

TheMammoth

Online Training Member
Feb 14, 2017
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I think some of you need to be on anxiety meds. Chill out and wait. Regardless of what you say or how you interpret something to be said isn't going to get anything to your doorstep any quicker. Quit worrying about your order number, pre/post SHOT orders or whatever it is that has your undies in a bunch. If you didn't realize before you put your money down that there would be a wait, tough shit. Not everything always goes as planned. So it disrupts delivery dates. Get over it.

100% this.
 
Likes: jgs8163
Feb 10, 2017
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A legitimate question here. Trying to future-proof my magazine purchase. My current action will do fine with magazines without binder plates in them and cartridges out to whatever the length can be. 2.97" or something. Will the Nucleus be able to do the same or should I get magazines with binder plates to keep things from catching up under the feed ramp?
 

bohem

PVA's HMFIC
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A legitimate question here. Trying to future-proof my magazine purchase. My current action will do fine with magazines without binder plates in them and cartridges out to whatever the length can be. 2.97" or something. Will the Nucleus be able to do the same or should I get magazines with binder plates to keep things from catching up under the feed ramp?
The ARC mag has an internal length of 2.96-ish as I recall.
The Nucleus prototype that's in my hands, currently built into a production-intent JHR, it feeds 2.95" COAL 308's without a problem.



Before there is a flurry of speculation here is what "production intent" means


Production Intent is a prototype that is made on

Production Tooling/Workholding/Machinery
Production raw materials (barrel blanks, triggers, stocks, etc)
Production Artwork
Production Packaging
etc

It is, for all intents, a production component but it isn't being sold. It's a T&E for internal review.

We have a Production Intent JHR.

Production barrel blank - check
Production barrel cutting process - check
Production Contour/Chambering/Threading/etc - check
Production stock - check
Production trigger - check
Production Brake - check
Production engraving - check

Production Action - No, we have a pre-production prototype.

We have exactly 1 prototype.
There are exactly 3 prototypes in existence
We have 1
SAC has 1
ARC has 1

That's it.

People have seen them, handled them at SHOT, and some folks have gotten to shoot them when they happen to bump into myself, Ted, or Mark Gordon when one of us happened to be doing test work.


The JHR that I'm taking to the ELR match in 10 days is the production intent gun.
It's a production barrel, trigger, stock, scope, rings, brake, etc. EVERYTHING except the action is a production part and if someone needed it I could take it all apart and hand them everything except the action. It would screw together into a JHR.

But... because of the Marking Variance not being approved yet we do not have clearance by the ATF to allow ARC to laser the JHR logos and markings on the receiver bodies. They're done, sitting at ARC's shop awaiting laser, then nitride, then they come to PVA. Until we get through the milestone of the the marking variance being approved then the PVA work route is to keep knocking out barrels and writing the details with a sharpie.

Once we have a production action in place we will do final fit for clocking and start burning the laser work on the barrels.

The entire world will know when the marking variance comes through, trust me, it will be in the news. Until then, there's no such thing as an estimated date on when the paperwork will come back.
 

Winny94

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Nov 19, 2013
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The ARC mag has an internal length of 2.96-ish as I recall.
The Nucleus prototype that's in my hands, currently built into a production-intent JHR, it feeds 2.95" COAL 308's without a problem.



Before there is a flurry of speculation here is what "production intent" means


Production Intent is a prototype that is made on

Production Tooling/Workholding/Machinery
Production raw materials (barrel blanks, triggers, stocks, etc)
Production Artwork
Production Packaging
etc

It is, for all intents, a production component but it isn't being sold. It's a T&E for internal review.

We have a Production Intent JHR.

Production barrel blank - check
Production barrel cutting process - check
Production Contour/Chambering/Threading/etc - check
Production stock - check
Production trigger - check
Production Brake - check
Production engraving - check

Production Action - No, we have a pre-production prototype.

We have exactly 1 prototype.
There are exactly 3 prototypes in existence
We have 1
SAC has 1
ARC has 1

That's it.

People have seen them, handled them at SHOT, and some folks have gotten to shoot them when they happen to bump into myself, Ted, or Mark Gordon when one of us happened to be doing test work.


The JHR that I'm taking to the ELR match in 10 days is the production intent gun.
It's a production barrel, trigger, stock, scope, rings, brake, etc. EVERYTHING except the action is a production part and if someone needed it I could take it all apart and hand them everything except the action. It would screw together into a JHR.

But... because of the Marking Variance not being approved yet we do not have clearance by the ATF to allow ARC to laser the JHR logos and markings on the receiver bodies. They're done, sitting at ARC's shop awaiting laser, then nitride, then they come to PVA. Until we get through the milestone of the the marking variance being approved then the PVA work route is to keep knocking out barrels and writing the details with a sharpie.

Once we have a production action in place we will do final fit for clocking and start burning the laser work on the barrels.

The entire world will know when the marking variance comes through, trust me, it will be in the news. Until then, there's no such thing as an estimated date on when the paperwork will come back.

I know this update was written with the intent to head off anymore questions or specualtion, but it's sure going to be fun to see what everyone read between the lines haha
 
Aug 3, 2017
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But... because of the Marking Variance not being approved yet we do not have clearance by the ATF to allow ARC to laser the JHR logos and markings on the receiver bodies. They're done, sitting at ARC's shop awaiting laser, then nitride, then they come to PVA. Until we get through the milestone of the the marking variance being approved then the PVA work route is to keep knocking out barrels and writing the details with a sharpie.
There we have it. Waiting on the man. Thanks for the update bohem!
 
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Bradu

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Aug 24, 2011
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I think some of you need to be on anxiety meds. Chill out and wait. Regardless of what you say or how you interpret something to be said isn't going to get anything to your doorstep any quicker. Quit worrying about your order number, pre/post SHOT orders or whatever it is that has your undies in a bunch. If you didn't realize before you put your money down that there would be a wait, tough shit. Not everything always goes as planned. So it disrupts delivery dates. Get over it.
I dont think xanax is enough for a couple of these fuckers lol
 

bohem

PVA's HMFIC
Jan 6, 2009
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www.patriotvalleyarms.com
This thread is about the Nucleus/Hancocks and this may seem unrelated however it's quite pertinent.
The barrels we are making for the Nucleus/Hancocks are extremely good. Though, being the internet, there is always a naysayer that wants to bring up the cut rifled vs. button rifled horse carcass and beat on it a little bit.

Here's another example of just how good the OEM barrels are.

This is a customer submitted photo with a Tikka prefit barrel chambered in 260 Remington.
Noteworthy is not only the group size but also the ES and SD attained during load development.
The blank used was a uncontoured, PVA-OEM 6.5mm 8 twist that we took from an unturned piece of 1.28" material down to a Tikka prefit with our barrel nut. We contoured, chambered, threaded, made the muzzle caps for it in house so that we can control as much of the manufacturing process as possible in house.

As with all of our Tikka line, the barrel nut is included along with the crowfoot wrench... delivered to this customer for $499.

We have Tikka action wrenches shortly available again. They're being black oxide treated right now and upon return will be lasered with torque recommendations before shipping.

tikka 260 prefit.jpg
 

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Sierra770

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While the news of the email is good, I have chosen to temper my excitement. It's still single source/unverified info at this point. There are a boat load of us that ordered within 24 hours of the opening that haven't been emailed. There may have been an issue with that individual's order.... who knows?
 
Likes: hereinaz

flyer

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Apr 25, 2018
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It's probably batch size and I bet ARC only sends out notifications for the batches that are almost ready to ship.

The important thing is that things are beginning to move out of ARC to the customer.

All I want to see is a reasonably consistent flow of actions out of ARC that will hopefully project to a July or August delivery date for me but any projection would be good.

And I'm not asking for a projection, I can figure that out myself once we start to see what rate the actions are coming out at.
 
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