New SCHMIDT BENDER Reticle - LRR-Mil - detailed info and pics

jb1000br

Jason@EuroOptic
Dec 23, 2001
602
67
28
On my Belly
#53
Sorry Bill - surprised me too lol

FYI - Price corrected since last night - much better now: 5-25 LRR-MIL

Planning to test one out to 1K soon - the dot is soooooo small I love it!

More pics to come, but check this one out for now - you can not appreciate it without really seeing it though.

LRR.jpg
 

sinister

Gunny Sergeant
Apr 16, 2002
1,594
25
48
Park City, Utah
#54
That is in section 1 if you click on the link in the first post.
1.6mm@100M or 0.016MRAD or 0.055MOA by my math(slightly smaller than the line thickness of a Nightforce MOAR-T or NP-R1/NP-R2
Jason
Roughly .40 inches at 100 Meters -- so about the same coverage as a 338 bullet at 100 yards.
 

wjm308

Send it!
Nov 30, 2012
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Black Forest, CO
#55
Sorry Bill - surprised me too lol

FYI - Price corrected since last night - much better now: 5-25 LRR-MIL

Planning to test one out to 1K soon - the dot is soooooo small I love it!

More pics to come, but check this one out for now - you can not appreciate it without really seeing it though.

View attachment 6919648
Interesting, the numbers on the left look huge but I guess it's so you can read them at lower magnifications. Are your specs on the website correct:
You show - Scope Weight:2.79 lbs (1265 grams) which is quite a bit more than the typical Schmidt 5-25?
It also says "no" illumination, but I thought the LRR-Mil had an illuminated center cross?
 

Mr. F

Sergeant of the Hide
Dec 10, 2011
296
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#59
Shit thats tempting.

Im paused at 4K, thought they d be priced north of 3K at around 3.5k but im tempted still.
 

wjm308

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Nov 30, 2012
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#60
Shit thats tempting.

Im paused at 4K, thought they d be priced north of 3K at around 3.5k but im tempted still.
I can't figure S&B out, I thought with this being their own reticle there would not be a premium like we see with Horus or MSR, they obviously think very highly of their reticle! I wonder if the MSR2 will come in at the same price as the current MSR or will be closer to the LRR-Mil pricing? This is approaching Tangent Theta territory, at this price I'd wait to see when the new TT reticles might be available. I think it's also about time for Schmidt to update their 5-25 design, with so much competition these days the shortcomings of the PMII are pretty obvious, if I was spending $3k+ on a scope I'd certainly be drawn to one of the newer designs.
 
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Nik H

Constantly Learning
Jan 22, 2014
3,924
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Rhode Island
#61
I can't figure S&B out, I thought with this being their own reticle there would not be a premium like we see with Horus or MSR, they obviously think very highly of their reticle! I wonder if the MSR2 will come in at the same price as the current MSR or will be closer to the LRR-Mil pricing? This is approaching Tangent Theta territory, at this price I'd wait to see when the new TT reticles might be available. I think it's also about time for Schmidt to update their 5-25 design, with so much competition these days the shortcomings of the PMII are pretty obvious, if I was spending $3k+ on a scope I'd certainly be drawn to one of the newer designs.
I said the same thing. Why wouldn't it debut on the 3-27 or 5-45?

I love my 5-25 PMII but it does have shortcomings compared to my NF 7-35.
 
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wjm308

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#63
I said the same thing. Why wouldn't it debut on the 3-27 or 5-45?

I love my 5-25 PMII but it does have shortcomings compared to my NF 7-35.
I suppose they wanted it to debut on their highest selling model (I am assuming the 5-25 is their highest selling) first, it is supposed to show up in the 3-27 and 5-45 as well, but I wonder how long that will take.
Sure would be nice if they came out with a PMIII that improved upon the 5-25 design.
 
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Vargmat

Sergeant
Apr 17, 2013
369
102
43
Sweden
#66
I cant help but thinking that there is literally nothing I like about this reticle. The "quick ranging" tree in the lower left is just obnoxious.
Also, written instructions included in the reticle is just wrong. You learn that shit once and then just use it.
 
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JT505

Sergeant
Mar 19, 2006
75
22
8
FL
#67
Done with these thin lined stadia reticles which work best 'exploded' above 10x, at mid or long range - and most use while laying on a mat,,,
I own many S&B's and this reticle is just another drafting diagram I want nothing to do with.

Most keep pushing for more magnification, Christmas tree reticles, thinner stadia lines and fine aim points at the highest possible magnification.
This thread as example; minus my comments. The guys who want to shoot long range, zoomed in - fine, go for it. You have your reticles. You keep getting what YOU want. Bring back some of the 'old' reticle choices many of us want and can SEE and USE at all magnifications and ranges,,,,
Again, I don't want anymore "Fine" reticles or fine-line diagrams which work best at 25-plus magnification and 1200+ yards.

I liked the P4 reticle when it wasn't 'Fine',,,, and its no longer offered, nor is the P3 Mildot or the Gen II Mildot. The MSR I have in one 5-20 US works but even its not available in most PMII's. Now we need directions in the reticle on how to use said reticle? The pendulum has swung too far the other way,,,,
 

Conrad

Gunny Sergeant
Apr 28, 2006
1,349
67
48
TX
#68
Reading your post made me think about how a lot of people dis the NF MILR but in actuality it’s a pretty good reticle, especially in the NF 4-16 F1. It is useable at all mag ranges and bold enough to really draw the eye and show up on a variety of back grounds and lighting.


Done with these thin lined stadia reticles which work best 'exploded' above 10x, at mid or long range - and most use while laying on a mat,,,
I own many S&B's and this reticle is just another drafting diagram I want nothing to do with.

Most keep pushing for more magnification, Christmas tree reticles, thinner stadia lines and fine aim points at the highest possible magnification.
This thread as example; minus my comments. The guys who want to shoot long range, zoomed in - fine, go for it. You have your reticles. You keep getting what YOU want. Bring back some of the 'old' reticle choices many of us want and can SEE and USE at all magnifications and ranges,,,,
Again, I don't want anymore "Fine" reticles or fine-line diagrams which work best at 25-plus magnification and 1200+ yards.

I liked the P4 reticle when it wasn't 'Fine',,,, and its no longer offered, nor is the P3 Mildot or the Gen II Mildot. The MSR I have in one 5-20 US works but even its not available in most PMII's. Now we need directions in the reticle on how to use said reticle? The pendulum has swung too far the other way,,,,
 
#69
Gotta disagree with JT505 I think the p4f is "THE Standard" for a reticle, I'm also fond of the gen2XR, milc and G2/G3 from Bushnell. I have and am not fond of my S&B H59, that is just too busy for me. I think for ELR the S&B LRR might be interesting but I'd want to compare it to MSR2 first.
 

lash

Swamp Rat
Sep 28, 2012
3,239
918
113
59
Central Florida
#70
Well, before we enter an episode of "Reticle Wars - Snipers Hide Edition", let's not forget two important things.
  • Intended use and
  • Personal preference
If there truly was one perfect reticle for everything and every person, there would be no need for variety. Reticle arguments are probably more ridiculous than glass arguments, but then what do I know. I'm stupid enough to think that the P4LF is great for ELR work but sucks for closer and quicker shots at lesser ranges. At 500-700 and in I prefer a heavier reticle with less fine crap interfering with a quick shot decision. For close in hunting and or carbine style matches, I want low power, quick reticle centering and large FOV. Each one has its place and I no more have one do-it-all reticle than I have one do-it-all rifle or one do-it-all scope.
 

jb1000br

Jason@EuroOptic
Dec 23, 2001
602
67
28
On my Belly
#71
Done with these thin lined stadia reticles which work best 'exploded' above 10x, at mid or long range - and most use while laying on a mat,,,
I own many S&B's and this reticle is just another drafting diagram I want nothing to do with.

Most keep pushing for more magnification, Christmas tree reticles, thinner stadia lines and fine aim points at the highest possible magnification.
This thread as example; minus my comments. The guys who want to shoot long range, zoomed in - fine, go for it. You have your reticles. You keep getting what YOU want. Bring back some of the 'old' reticle choices many of us want and can SEE and USE at all magnifications and ranges,,,,
Again, I don't want anymore "Fine" reticles or fine-line diagrams which work best at 25-plus magnification and 1200+ yards.

I liked the P4 reticle when it wasn't 'Fine',,,, and its no longer offered, nor is the P3 Mildot or the Gen II Mildot. The MSR I have in one 5-20 US works but even its not available in most PMII's. Now we need directions in the reticle on how to use said reticle? The pendulum has swung too far the other way,,,,

JT - I got you covered on the fatties!

5-25 P3
 

jb1000br

Jason@EuroOptic
Dec 23, 2001
602
67
28
On my Belly
#72
Got the new THRU-PICS added! - Check out the first real pics of the reticle - I have taken a lot of pics thru scopes and this one was a bugger, but I did the best I could:

LRR-MIL Reticle THRU-PICS...in an actual scope

As to the cost difference, I was a bit surprised as well, but I would have to assume it is due to the new daylight illumination aspect and the manufacturing cost increase to make what is currently the finest FFP illuminated reticle that exists.
 

gconnoyer

Online Training Member
Dec 19, 2017
75
31
18
29
St Louis, MO
#73
That looks awesome. Nice and simple and clean still, but alot more usable than whats currently available!

The only part I dont like is the two dashes inside the first half mil, but with the manual and seeing what they measure, and what the gaps are, they may actually work out nicely.
 

wjm308

Send it!
Nov 30, 2012
1,992
764
113
Black Forest, CO
#74
I didn't realize it had daylight bright illumination, is this a first for S&B long range scopes as the 3 Schmidt's I've had have not had daylight bright illumination. Regarding "finest FFP illuminated reticle that exists" come on Jason, you know that is a very subjective statement ;)
 

Nik H

Constantly Learning
Jan 22, 2014
3,924
1,778
113
Rhode Island
#77
Got the new THRU-PICS added! - Check out the first real pics of the reticle - I have taken a lot of pics thru scopes and this one was a bugger, but I did the best I could:

LRR-MIL Reticle THRU-PICS...in an actual scope

As to the cost difference, I was a bit surprised as well, but I would have to assume it is due to the new daylight illumination aspect and the manufacturing cost increase to make what is currently the finest FFP illuminated reticle that exists.
Very nice...I liked this the first time I saw it a year ago. I have a few questions that you can't probably answer but I will ask anyways.

  1. I know it is available or will be on the 5-25 PMII first. When is it going to roll out on the 5-45?
  2. I would assume that the 5-25 PMII that I bought from you cannot be upgraded. Can you confirm? Although I like that scope, it has been supplanted by the NF 7-35 MIL-C, also bought from you, on my AI. The S&B sits on my Larue AR10 right now. If upgrading the 5-25 is not possible, are there trade-up deals we can do? You can PM if you don't wish to discuss openly.
 

jb1000br

Jason@EuroOptic
Dec 23, 2001
602
67
28
On my Belly
#78
Bill - I should have clarified - "thinnest aim-point":geek:

Nik:
1 - they have repeatedly stuck with late summer on the others with the LRR reticle.
2 - don't know yet, but finding out on the retrofit

Thanks!
 

Clearlight

Full Member
Jul 23, 2014
730
268
63
Brisbane Australia
#79
Here’s an illuminated reticle out of an FFP 5 - 40 March , next to a standard BIC gas lighter . I talked to
Mr Shimizu from DEON about the difficulties making an illuminated reticle in high zoom ratio optics at
Shot Show last year . The higher the zoom ratio, the more difficult it becomes . S & B will have discovered
this , especially in the 9x zoom 5 - 45 .

These high zoom FFP designs are pushing the boundaries of optical design , and industrial technology
capability . I look forward to seeing the new reticle in the 5 - 45 .
 

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