Hands on Origin/Nucleus at SHOT?

Feb 22, 2013
250
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Milwaukee, WI
#51
Question for the people that handled the Nucleus at SHOT Show last week:

When talking about the bolt lift, were you able to dry-fire the action and cycle the bolt where it actually cocked it? Or was this simply cycling the bolt with the action already cocked?

In my experience with my AIs and the new Mausingfield I just picked up, there is a significant difference in cycling the bolt when it is cocked vs uncocked.
 
Jul 24, 2011
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Dothan, AL
#52
Samb300,

Look at the video that Short Actions Customs made. The was dry firing and cocking in opening with one finger.

I’m with you on the bolt lift. My AX is the same way. It is relatively stiff on cocking.....not unbearable, but in certain awkward positions it is noticeable. This is exactly why I was so curious about the bolt lift. Bolt lift only matters on cocking. People running a 3 lug action in videos with no trigger just tells me it’s smooth (which is great), not light.
 
Dec 19, 2008
560
3
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Fort lauderdale, Fl
#53
Confused listener over here with zero customs. So what’s the main reason to go TL3 now instead of the orgin? Seems to have damn near everything for a cheaper price. I see that the orgin has a pinned recoil lug...what’s the negative of that compared to the TL3?
Sogan,
My understanding is that the Origin is as specified. Where the TL3 has all the options. AW mags, 3 different tang thicknesses, port side, 3 different moa rails and its made of stainless w integral lug.

I have been contemplating a TL3 , but I just ordered the origin.

From what I have read I hope that answers your question.
 
Nov 19, 2013
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#54
Question for the people that handled the Nucleus at SHOT Show last week:

When talking about the bolt lift, were you able to dry-fire the action and cycle the bolt where it actually cocked it? Or was this simply cycling the bolt with the action already cocked?

In my experience with my AIs and the new Mausingfield I just picked up, there is a significant difference in cycling the bolt when it is cocked vs uncocked.
haha obviously cocking it
 
Sep 6, 2006
1,715
36
48
Southern California
#55
Question for the people that handled the Nucleus at SHOT Show last week:

When talking about the bolt lift, were you able to dry-fire the action and cycle the bolt where it actually cocked it? Or was this simply cycling the bolt with the action already cocked?

In my experience with my AIs and the new Mausingfield I just picked up, there is a significant difference in cycling the bolt when it is cocked vs uncocked.
An action without a trigger always cocks on opening since the stiker will ride down the cocking cam each time the bolt is closed.
 
Likes: diverdon

Lofty

Gunny Sergeant
Jun 14, 2008
1,323
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Lenexa KS
#61
I am a big fan of ARC, sadly the Nucleus felt cheap. The bolt was sloppy.

Im sure that it probably wont affect accuracy, I just didnt like how it felt.
 

mi223

Full Member
Feb 14, 2017
275
9
18
#62
Another question. Will the swept bolt handle on the origin work in a standard 700 stock or chassis without modification to the bolt handle cutout?
 
Sep 6, 2006
1,715
36
48
Southern California
#63
Another question. Will the swept bolt handle on the origin work in a standard 700 stock or chassis without modification to the bolt handle cutout?
I’ve wondered this myself and I’m thinking no. The rem is flat bottomed and fairly small. A tl3 needs clearancing near the round underside of the handle. The origin looks identical except for the sweep.
 
May 12, 2017
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#64
I am a big fan of ARC, sadly the Nucleus felt cheap. The bolt was sloppy.

Im sure that it probably wont affect accuracy, I just didnt like how it felt.
Damn, thats the first bad report I've heard. When you say the bolt was sloppy, were you able to feel movement when the bolt was closed?
 

5RWill

Tempest Aficionado
Oct 15, 2009
3,609
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MIssissippi
#65
Another question. Will the swept bolt handle on the origin work in a standard 700 stock or chassis without modification to the bolt handle cutout?
My EH1 is actually fit for a swept handle and my straight TL3 works in it. They seemed to have Origins sitting in various stocks/chassis' on that video i posted.
 

mi223

Full Member
Feb 14, 2017
275
9
18
#66
My EH1 is actually fit for a swept handle and my straight TL3 works in it. They seemed to have Origins sitting in various stocks/chassis' on that video i posted.
It could be fine it kind of looks like it has a small straight portion then it is swept back. Maybe that is just enough to clear?
 
Feb 14, 2017
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#67
Another question. Will the swept bolt handle on the origin work in a standard 700 stock or chassis without modification to the bolt handle cutout?
Yes. They had one in an old 700 BDL stock and said they barely had to open the ejection port cut.
 

Lofty

Gunny Sergeant
Jun 14, 2008
1,323
2
38
50
Lenexa KS
#68
Damn, thats the first bad report I've heard. When you say the bolt was sloppy, were you able to feel movement when the bolt was closed?
No, thats why I said I am sure it wont affect accuracy, it locked up tight. Just running the bolt it felt flimsy and not precise. I got to finger bang the new Defiance and there was no comparison. Of course it was more expensive as well, so its to be expected. Im just real picky about little things like that.

Again, not a slam on ARC, I love Ted's stuff and at this actions price point I cant expect it to be on par with actions costing nearly twice as much.

Just an observation.
 

mi223

Full Member
Feb 14, 2017
275
9
18
#69
So is there anyone else who still hasnt pulled the trigger but really thinking about purchasing one of these in the last days of the presale?

I think the nucleus looks bad ass but i am kind of leaning towards the more traditional style of the origin. The cheaper price tag dosnt hurt either.
 
Likes: blackblue
Feb 27, 2017
9
4
3
#70
So is there anyone else who still hasnt pulled the trigger but really thinking about purchasing one of these in the last days of the presale?

I think the nucleus looks bad ass but i am kind of leaning towards the more traditional style of the origin. The cheaper price tag dosnt hurt either.
More or less in the same boat.
Leaning towards bighorn, the upfront and overall cost for the action and a second bolt head it is a fair bit cheaper. Only qualm is my interest with the barloc. That being discounted too right now levels out the cost, so it comes down to features for me. Always really liked the TL3 but it was more expensive than I was willing to pay, hence the leaning towards bighorn.

With both presales running out end of day tomorrow planning in sleeping on it again and placing an order tomorrow evening. Highly doubt you can go wrong with either one based on both company's reputations and the current support from PVA and others for barrels and accessories.
 

Ledzep

Chancellor
Jun 9, 2009
1,191
48
48
Black Hills
#71
I'm going to have to hold off until I can think of a good plan. I'd like one but I'm in the middle of a CZ mini mauser build, and my 6.5 SAUM Mausingfield covers most bases. Maybe a 28 Nosler or .30 or .338 RUM big boomer. Could rebarrel the 6.5SAUM to a standard 6-6.5mm when I toast the barrel and have little, medium, big. Nothing pressing, though. $150 difference won't mean much by the time I get around to it.
 
Feb 14, 2017
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DC Area, MD
#73
I ended up ordering a .223 bolt face short action, but I can't help but think maybe I should have just gotten a long action magnum. I'm probably never going to buy AI's AXMC and my AX308 owns my short action space in the safe, but I've never really wanted a magnum nor do I have the space to open it up or desire to feed it.
 

NateVA

Full Member
Feb 10, 2017
515
14
18
#74
I'm going to have to hold off until I can think of a good plan. I'd like one but I'm in the middle of a CZ mini mauser build, and my 6.5 SAUM Mausingfield covers most bases. Maybe a 28 Nosler or .30 or .338 RUM big boomer. Could rebarrel the 6.5SAUM to a standard 6-6.5mm when I toast the barrel and have little, medium, big. Nothing pressing, though. $150 difference won't mean much by the time I get around to it.
I went with a long action magnum for an elk rifle. My Mausingfield short action also covers all the other bases so it was the only thing I could think of. I basically took a couple hours after seeing their Facebook post to make up a reason why I needed to buy one. It wasn't my proudest moment but after seeing the reviews of it from people who went to SHOT Show I feel validated in my impulsiveness. By the looks of things I made an okay decision because there appears to be a long line for preorders now.
 
Likes: Ledzep

5RWill

Tempest Aficionado
Oct 15, 2009
3,609
93
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MIssissippi
#76
Was the nucleus at shot show a complete rifle? I'm wondering if the barloc is going to fit in to a chassis inletted for a 700 action or if the barloc is going to be too bulky.
The Hancock rifle was a full build IIRC but i don't think it had the barloc on it.
 

BWB

Sergeant
Mar 18, 2009
240
0
16
SD
#77
With the features and feel the Origin offers at it's price point (even after Feb 1) unless you hate a 90 degree bolt throw, this is an easy decision. The swept back bolt handle makes this action able to drop into any Rem 700 stock/chassis without modification. There's no doubt this is a clear winner for BigHorn.
 

Jon_ARC

American Rifle Company
Aug 3, 2017
4
6
3
#78
A buddy of mine who builds guns, and is not a fan of ARC or the mausingfield, put hands on a nucleus. He ordered one that day. Said it was a sweet feeling action.

I already have a tl3, and love it. Not super hot on the mausingfield. The nucleus was just too neat to ignore so I ordered one myself. According to the guys at the ARC booth, the pre-SHOT show preorders were so huge, they’re booked to the end of the year.
Sales of the Nucleus have been very strong but nothing that we were not prepared for. Deliveries should start in the spring and may go into summer but no way beyond that.
 
Likes: Sierra770
Dec 1, 2009
404
2
18
Bedico, Louisiana
#80
I went with the bighorn. The Nucleus is pretty nice, but Ive wanted a bighorn for a while and this Origin lets me in the club. End result is a switch barrel, but it will come in phases.
 
Jan 26, 2009
379
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Georgia
#81
I may still order one tomorrow, but there are a few aesthetics about the Nucleus that I just don't like. Again, just personal taste.

1. I really do not like the shape of the bolt handle on Mausingfield or the Nucleus. The swept look from large to skinny from bolt to handle just doesn't appeal to me.

2. Maybe it's an optical illusion, but it seems the picatinny rail on both actions sit higher than on others. Again, could be visual perception.

The rail height I can deal with, but the handle is about as bad as skinny jeans on a guy.

I still may buy one though. The concept seems right on!
 
Jan 26, 2009
379
5
18
Georgia
#83
I ended up ordering two Nuclei. I already have a TL3, and while it's a nice action, I just doesn't "feel" super high end. I've cycled 700s that felt nicer.
I want to say "are you serious", but I don't want to sound sarcastic and I hate coined phrases. But are you? I have thought about buying a TL3 because I'm looking at several actions, but it would be a real disappointment if there isn't a galaxy of difference between a $1250 action and my broken in 700.
 
Jan 26, 2009
379
5
18
Georgia
#84
I have also been told that you have to run the TL3 just right or the bolt wants to bind.

It makes me wonder if those guys who say a Tikka is 99% of a custom with a 30 % price tag are telling the truth.
 

5RWill

Tempest Aficionado
Oct 15, 2009
3,609
93
48
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MIssissippi
#85
The TL3 isn't the tightest bolt action i've ever had. It has some play, doesn't really bother me though and it seems most that run them either. It can be a little sticky if you try to bind it, like apply lateral force whilst trying to close the bolt. If you run it like a regular bolt action it runs well. I've not felt a remington that's nicer, but it's not as tight or smooth as my Tempest or a deviant.
 

lennyo3034

Gunny Sergeant
Apr 18, 2010
1,470
26
48
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Southern MD
#86
I want to say "are you serious", but I don't want to sound sarcastic and I hate coined phrases. But are you? I have thought about buying a TL3 because I'm looking at several actions, but it would be a real disappointment if there isn't a galaxy of difference between a $1250 action and my broken in 700.
It's very subjective. A friend that owns a Defiance really likes the feel of my Bighorn. I prefer the Defiance.

It's hard to describe. It's certainly smooth and I've never had an issue binding with it. It is certainly not as tight as a Nesika that I handled recently, but it's designed that way. Upon cycling it, it's obviously more refined than a 700, but I just don't get that "glass" feel. This is really not a complaint against the TL3, its done everything I've needed it to and is very well made.

That being said, my Tikka T3x never really smoothened up either. Yes it's slicker than most other actions, but never has that "glass" feel.

The smoothest action I've ever felt was a used Steyr Pro Hunter. If it wasn't retardedly expensive from Cabela's used gun rack ($300 more expensive that a new one), I'd have bought it on the spot.
 
Likes: Sierra770
Feb 10, 2017
102
2
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#87
I also wanted the Bighorn for a while, but I really just wanted the best action for me. The Nucleus gives me CRF and mechanical ejection, which were my main reasons for looking at Bighorn, plus it's a three lug and a 72 degree bolt throw, which I was wanting. The Nucleus just blended all the features I wanted into one action at an amazing price. Couldn't pass.
 
Likes: Sierra770
Sep 6, 2006
1,715
36
48
Southern California
#88
I want to say "are you serious", but I don't want to sound sarcastic and I hate coined phrases. But are you? I have thought about buying a TL3 because I'm looking at several actions, but it would be a real disappointment if there isn't a galaxy of difference between a $1250 action and my broken in 700.
lol, I was thinking the same thing. My tl3 is just about perfection. Not even reminiscent of a 700. Mine is utterly glass, and one of the nicest bolt actions I’ve ever operated, and I’ve owned a lot. When people watch me work that action, they notice oddly and coment on its smoothness. My own experience with defiance has kept me away from them. Mine wasn’t terrible, but I was unhappy with it ultimately.

Unlocked, it can feel like a $2 whore. Who cares what it feels like unlocked as long as it’s feeding and not binding. On that note, my AW hands down smokes everything. Not as smooth as a tl3, but the most functional non-binding action out there.
 
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mi223

Full Member
Feb 14, 2017
275
9
18
#89
The rail height I can deal with, but the handle is about as bad as skinny jeans on a guy.

I still may buy one though. The concept seems right on!
Lol. I have to agree with you on the bolt handle. They are designed for function but really missed the mark on looks.


I just bit on a origin. I really like the nucleus but the extra money towards a totally unique action with very little to no user feedback scares me a little. I feel like with the origin i am basically buying a more economical version of the proven tl3.
 

Sierra770

Online Training Member
Nov 2, 2013
165
9
18
Atlanta, GA
#90
Lol. I have to agree with you on the bolt handle. They are designed for function but really missed the mark on looks.


I just bit on a origin. I really like the nucleus but the extra money towards a totally unique action with very little to no user feedback scares me a little. I feel like with the origin i am basically buying a more economical version of the proven tl3.
Your point is valid about the lack of user feedback on the Nuecleus. The Origin is a safer play. However, the mausingfield had its skeptics initially as well and ARC didn't disappoint. I am rolling the dice with ARC because the innovation is worthy of exploring. Besides the regular price on the origin doesn't make is cost prohibitive if ARC doesnt meet my expectations.
 

bohem

PVA's HMFIC
Jan 6, 2009
6,997
156
63
Southeast, PA
www.patriotvalleyarms.com
#91
No, thats why I said I am sure it wont affect accuracy, it locked up tight. Just running the bolt it felt flimsy and not precise. I got to finger bang the new Defiance and there was no comparison. Of course it was more expensive as well, so its to be expected. Im just real picky about little things like that.

Again, not a slam on ARC, I love Ted's stuff and at this actions price point I cant expect it to be on par with actions costing nearly twice as much.

Just an observation.
Actually, what you observed is specifically designed in for reliability and has nothing to do with "cheapness".
For some reason this industry feels that "tight" is more accurate when it really has nothing to do with the accuracy once proper bolt head alignment is addressed (toroidal lugs or a floating head). What it does have to do with is how the action runs when it gets dirty and anyone that's felt a Defiance with a sneeze of Oklahoma/Texas/Colorado/Wyoming dust in it knows what I mean.

My first Defiance has gall marks on the lugs and bolt body because of this.

The NUCLEUS rides on the antibind rails in the bolt head and receiver, this makes it more reliable in dirty conditions and far less prone to getting bound up when the bolt is manipulated in anything except the "correct" way.

Ultimately it will end up being a faster action because of the way it's setup.
 
Feb 16, 2017
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#92
Lol. I have to agree with you on the bolt handle. They are designed for function but really missed the mark on looks.


I just bit on a origin. I really like the nucleus but the extra money towards a totally unique action with very little to no user feedback scares me a little. I feel like with the origin i am basically buying a more economical version of the proven tl3.
Eh to each their own, I like the ARC bolt handle and it has worked well for me on my Mausingfield. Plus it is instantly recognizable, you can easily pick it out on pictures even when you can't see the rest of the action.

As for the actions themselves I went with the Nucleus over the origin. I love CRF and only buy bolt actions with it, adding the only CRF three lug action to my collection was not an if but a when. Combine that with the Barloc integration for switching barrels and it was a home run for me.
 

Sierra770

Online Training Member
Nov 2, 2013
165
9
18
Atlanta, GA
#93
I don't see how customers could lose with either action. We may very well be witnessing the Golden Age of Precision Rifles. Lots of options, lots of price points and the Remington 700 and Savage are no longer the only budget friendly options.
 

5RWill

Tempest Aficionado
Oct 15, 2009
3,609
93
48
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MIssissippi
#94
Actually, what you observed is specifically designed in for reliability and has nothing to do with "cheapness".
For some reason this industry feels that "tight" is more accurate when it really has nothing to do with the accuracy once proper bolt head alignment is addressed (toroidal lugs or a floating head). What it does have to do with is how the action runs when it gets dirty and anyone that's felt a Defiance with a sneeze of Oklahoma/Texas/Colorado/Wyoming dust in it knows what I mean.

My first Defiance has gall marks on the lugs and bolt body because of this.

The NUCLEUS rides on the antibind rails in the bolt head and receiver, this makes it more reliable in dirty conditions and far less prone to getting bound up when the bolt is manipulated in anything except the "correct" way.

Ultimately it will end up being a faster action because of the way it's setup.
I agree. Though again i've never really understood bolt bind less someone is purposefully trying to bind the bolt whilst operating it. Is bolt bind people refer to induced due to running actions in harsh conditions?

Maybe i've not run my Tempest to the extent some of these guys do or in those environments mentioned. Even my 7005R which wasn't trued at all i never had binding issues out of. I get galled lugs and too tight of tolerance exhibited with dust and debris in an action. As you said it's bolt head alignment that matters over the feel of running the bolt back and forth through the raceway. I think some just love the feel of a "tight" action and i must admit my Tempest feels better than my Bighorn, maybe more controlled or refined is the word. I've not run into failure with either yet. Need to get my hands on a Nucleus but i'm afraid it would draw attention away from my other rifles lol.
 
Apr 25, 2014
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Boise, Idaho
#95
I played with the Nucleus at Shot. I really liked it. It has a great feature set, very smooth bolt operation and less than 90 degree throw.

Having said that, I do still like my Tempest better. But it's not really fair to compare a new action to my well broke in Tempest.
 
Mar 30, 2017
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#96
I went with the Bighorn Origin. It's a proven design based on the TL3. I was also talking to some guys who tried the actions at Shot Show and they were not impressed with the Nucleus three lug design.