Drones casing property/tresspassing- peeping drone

anon

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107.31 Visual line of sight aircraft operation.

107.31 Visual line of sight aircraft operation.
(a) With vision that is unaided by any device other than corrective lenses, the remote pilot in command, the visual observer (if one is used), and the person manipulating the flight control of the small unmanned aircraft system must be able to see the unmanned aircraft throughout the entire flight in order to:
(1) Know the unmanned aircraft's location;
(2) Determine the unmanned aircraft's attitude, altitude, and direction of flight;
(3) Observe the airspace for other air traffic or hazards; and
(4) Determine that the unmanned aircraft does not endanger the life or property of another.
(b) Throughout the entire flight of the small unmanned aircraft, the ability described in paragraph (a) of this section must be exercised by either:
(1) The remote pilot in command and the person manipulating the flight controls of the small unmanned aircraft system; or
(2) A visual observer.
Maybe a call to the local FSDO to report a drone that is apparently being operated beyond visual line of site, and asking who in the area has such authorization.
 

woogie_man

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Are you sure you know what type of "drone" it is?

I have many...though probably none that many here know how they function. Is it a phantom type camera platform, or a race type? One has a gimbal and can get some really good images. While the other has a stationary camera and is made for speed. While they both can hover...one has a camera that can move, while the other is typically at a 20°+ angle ( so a level quad has the camera pointed up)

Also have a few wings that go well over 100 mph, again with camera straight out and not able to move.

The detail on many are not that good, remember what you see on YouTube is typically from a GoPro style camera (on the racing/non phantom style)


Living in town I have flown many of my quads over my neighborhood. Only issue is when people are ignorant of the quad and buy into the media hype of perverts and peepers using them. A simple talk with my neighbors, as well as showing then the quad and letting them see what it looks like while flying, they all could care less about them.


Like stated previously as well...many different companies are using them for surveying and city work. Hell there may be a company that is using the area around your house as a test area.

Instead of doing anything stupid and getting in federal trouble....why not try and find where it is being flown from and talk to the operator? Typically a friendly talk will solve your issues
 

Gunfighter14e2

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"who cares' is the proper mentality to getting yourself in trouble.

Game wardens are flying drones now over property and I just happened to speak to a kid today who's dad shot down a drone while duck hunting. $3,500 later...
Laughing,...again who cares? Some people will go to their grave on their knees, some won't, but all will go at some point. The interesting thing I find is most oppressors have never fought for nothing except their wallet, or a higher spot on the ladder. An both have been at the expense or others who cowed,...
 
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regency

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Laughing,...again who cares? Some people will go to their grave on their knees, some won't, but all will go at some point. The interesting thing I find is most oppressors have never fought for nothing except their wallet, or a higher spot on the ladder. An both have been at the expense or others who cowed,...
The person with the drone and the government will care, is what I am saying. There's no doubt you don't care, but if you shot one down your wallet will.
 

Gunfighter14e2

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The person with the drone and the government will care, is what I am saying. There's no doubt you don't care, but if you shot one down your wallet will.
I doubt that as money means nothing to me ask around, but at least I get to tell my side of the story to the jury for it will not stop with just the downing of the drone. I fully believe in an have seen jury nullification in action once they know the truth of events not what paid mouths speak.
 

Dthomas3523

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As stated, shooting it down or otherwise will bring a world of shit down on you you wouldn't wish upon the drone pilot bothering you and your neighbors. You might as well shoot down a private plane as it's pretty much the same legal ramifications minus the murder.

Whoever claimed you must be over 500 feet to fly over property is wrong. Even referenced they knew this somehow through some sort of legal action. Fact of the matter is most drones are NOT allowed to fly over 400 feet. You can certainly fly over private property, planes do it every day, and the how low they can go is determined by the FAA NOT local law enforcement NOR the state law enforcement.

As mentioned, the FAA controls ALL airspace and rules for flying including drones. Google drone rules and you find about all you want to know. But, I bet you'll be pretty disappointed that you actually have very little to no teeth in stopping them from flying.

"Peeping" into windows is a completely different scenario and is very difficult to do w/ a commercially available drone. The cameras are good but not that good and just like a satellite in space, it can't see sideways w/o REALLY specialized camera equipment that's financially out of reach for just about anyone but large .govs.

Edit: .govs CAN limit where you fly from, i.e. city parks, etc. IF they own and control the property. They can NOT stop you from flying over city parks, etc. IF you are controlling from private property or legal flying locations. The ONLY rule that can stop you from flying over a city park, etc. is if there's a "group" of people. You can still fly over, just NOT the people. The FAA defines "group". Also, notice I reference rules when describing the FAA and flying. That's right, they're rules, not laws. There are laws that apply but most of this discussion will be around the 'rules'. Fixed wing hobby flyers have been dealing with these issues for years. Nothing new except how easy and well the modern drones fly by comparison.
FAA does not control all airspace. It’s controls all NAVIGABLE airspace.

Navigable airspace is different for most places. If a landowner can show that he is using the space above his property, (trees, antennae, or flying below a certain elevation will damage property or spook livestock), that is not longer navigable airspace.

The current problem with drones is there is no guidance on who actually controls that non navigable airspace. It’s a literal gray area.

The FAA doesn’t control that non navigable airspace and cannot fly there. But no law or legal ruling has actually stated the landowner has control of that non navigable airspace.

This creates a pretty big gray area that will need to be addressed pretty soon.

Also, generally speaking, FAA guidelines keep manned aircraft at 500ft and higher. They may or may not still consider lower than 500 as navigable airspace, depending on the situation.
 

rth1800

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I know little about drones.

I know enough about LE to not rely on them for anything.

I suspect the drone operator would be fairly easy to locate by non electronic means.

You could get neighbors to plot a course map if incursions are that common.

If the drone is destroyed in the hanger is it still protected by federal law?
 

regency

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Laughing,... you have been hanging around the wrong crowds to long. Some peoples kin founded this country, an others have been trying to change it from day one. Easy to tell which crowd are you from,...

Most everyone on this site has relatives that have fought for this country including themselves. How are you more special again? Re-read post 60.
 

W54/XM-388

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I fully believe in an have seen jury nullification in action once they know the truth of events not what paid mouths speak.
As long as you don't have a crooked judge refusing to allow testimony that would swing the jury to your side by telling them the whole truth.
Federal judges are well known for being crooked bastards like that, otherwise they couldn't keep up the high conviction rates they bully people into "confessing" with.
 
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stello1001

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Instead of doing anything stupid and getting in federal trouble....why not try and find where it is being flown from and talk to the operator? Typically a friendly talk will solve your issues
I'm pretty sure that's what the purpose of this thread is for.

I'm pretty sure that's what the OP is trying to do...
 

Gunfighter14e2

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As long as you don't have a crooked judge refusing to allow testimony that would swing the jury to your side by telling them the whole truth.
Federal judges are well known for being crooked bastards like that, otherwise they couldn't keep up the high conviction rates they bully people into "confessing" with.
Even crooked judges have been over ridden by jury nullification.
 

forrestgump01

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I don't think anyone in this thread has really pushed shooting it down for simply flying OVER YOUR property . As I stated before , big difference between flying over and actually flying around your property at a very low altitude in a harrasing way. Now just for argument sake on shooting it down, let's face it , the operator is not going to be insured . So when he's flying 30ft off the ground 50 ft from your house and crashes it into your house or your vehicle and does damage to your property then your screwed.
So let's see , I can stand there waiting for him to do damage to my property ,and then take him to court for the damages ( good luck getting blood from a turnip) , or you can shoot it down and take a chance with a jury of yours peers. You decide.

The one nice thing about the model airplane guys and their clubs is they are insured by the AMA and are covered for any damages when they are flying . this drone thing is a whole new ballgame.
 

Jefe's Dope

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ya my English teacher sucked , but probably hasn't sucked near as many as you have.
Like I said believe what you want , I don't need to argue, as I have had first hand experience with what someone can and can't do with a drone on your property . I will leave you with an open invitation to bring a drone to my neck of the woods and fly around on private property out here . it's a very small town and our law enforcement is extremely board out of there mind and would love to spend some time with you !
Promise you'll play your banjo and make me squeal like a pig? :geek:

BREWVIEWS_3937(DELIVERANCE).jpeg
 

george5419

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yes, im trying to locate the source of the drone..... its a bit more challanging than just following it home, or "ask the neighbors" report it or shoot it down.
This bugger dont want to be seen. comes at any or all times of the day or night and involving the system is of no value at this time.
we believe it has ill intent with its actions.
i Never stated i was going to shoot it down ( although that would be satisfing} but no valuable information would be collected and the operator would be wiser .
same as publicly posting any warnings .
there are several eletronic options available and are being addressed, and we have started to observe a couple patterns
once more details are finalized ill update as possible.
 
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thejeep

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It’s almost winter. Shoot it down while wearing a Halloween costume. Burn costume.

Who would believe the drone operator when he tells the police he was just flying around when he saw big foot humping mini mouse in your yard when they both pulled out 12g and his camera went fuzzy.
 

Pbgt

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Here in the northland, we use clear monofiliment fish line above your boatlift in an "x" pattern, to keep seagulls(white flying rats) from landing and shitting on everything.....see where I'm going op?
 

rth1800

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Are you having trouble answering my question?

Just don't shoot a drone as everyone here and the law states. ✌ out
You seem unduly interested in drone rights. Almost like you use one intrusively. ??
I suggest you simply keep your drones over your own property. No one will bother your equipment over your home.
Just don’t tread on others.
 
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Jefe's Dope

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Maybe they'll use their own drones to find drones. :geek:

 

bachelorjack

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High wattage used microwave oven.
Google wave guide.
Google microwave shielding.

A trip to the hardware store or amazon.

Aiming it will be tricky at first. You can try it out on tomatoes or oranges to get the hang of it.

When it goes down, don't touch it. Setup a game camera and see who comes to get it.
 
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roostercogburn98

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Well if you wanted to get really crazy. Just find a signal jammer and block all 2.4gH signals around your house. Most modern drones use this signal for flight control and either Bluetooth or HAM shortwave for the camera. If you know any ham operators in your area they might be able to track his camera signal. If the camera is Bluetooth controlled then they have limited operating range, probably in the 1.25-1.5 mile range IF that unless he has a amplifier on it. Just google RC Toy Jammer
 

Luke

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Honestly your best option is to try and follow the thing back to its controller. If you're in a rural/more open region, with a little area recon you should be able to get a rough idea of likely areas they might be located and as soon as you hear the thing outside be ready to roll and jump on a bike or in the car to follow it. If it's one of the nicer commercial drones like DJI, Parrot, etc. they more than likely are using a "return to home" button so as soon as operator is done flying around they press that and the drone makes a beeline to the operator, so you have a good idea of the direction it came from. If you're in a hilly area with long lines of sight they could be up to 2 or 3 miles away, but if you have a lot of trees or the ground is flat they're probably not more than a half mile away because the control signal will start to drop out, especially if the drone is coming down low to the ground. If you're in a urban area it would be very tough to find the source if someone is just popping it up out of their backyard. If you can get 2 or 3 people spread out and ready to triangulate via with walkie talkies when it heads home and it should be somewhat easy to find.

It's easy to get bent out of shape by people flying drones, but in the spirit of freedom I'm glad they can do so with little government interference. As gun owners we love to tout our personal freedoms, but tend to pounce on any other sport/hobby/freedom that we don't personally approve of. I don't personally like the fact I could have a drone hovering over my yard/property when I walk outside tomorrow morning, but I'm also glad I have the freedom to go buy a drone myself and fly over somebody else's yard/property :D
 

Jefe's Dope

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"DJI, which has an estimated 70% market share according to industry analysts,"

"Global spending on drones is likely to reach $12.3 billion in 2019, up from $9 billion a year earlier, according to research firm IDC."

DJI has a lot at stake and will do what they can to keep recreational drones going strong.
 

lash

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lash

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theLBC

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real estate agent?

they always be snapping pictures of other people's places.
 

jg6.5

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Drones are considered aircraft by the FAA, pretty sure if you shoot one down you’ll be in more trouble than the guy operating it inappropriately.
Hi,

I know this is not going to "go over" well (no pun intended lol) but IF you knock, shoot, net, etc etc a drone down without massive documentation/evidence of it causing "substantial interference with the use and enjoyment of the property." YOU will be the one going to jail!!

"Substantial interference with the use and enjoyment of the property" is to be based off the following:
(b) The determination of whether an unmanned aircraft’s operation over property has caused substantial interference with the use and enjoyment of property shall be based upon a review of the totality of the circumstances, including:
(1) The amount of time the unmanned aircraft was operated over the landowner’s property;
(2) The altitude at which the unmanned aircraft was operating;
(3) The number of times unmanned aircraft have been operated over the property;
(4) Whether the unmanned aircraft recorded or captured audio, video or photographs while in operation over the property;
(5) Whether the landowner has regularly allowed operation of unmanned aircraft over the property;
(6) Whether the operation of the unmanned aircraft caused physical damage to persons or property;
(7) Whether the operation of the unmanned aircraft caused economic damage;
(8) The time of day the unmanned aircraft was operated over the landowner’s property;
(9) Whether an individual on the land saw or heard the unmanned aircraft while it was over the property; and,
(10) The operator’s purpose in operating the unmanned aircraft over the property.
(c) Repeated or continual operation of an unmanned aircraft over a landowner’s property shall not give rise to prescriptive rights in the airspace

Remember...Gas companies, electric companies, underground utility companies, tax assessors, etc etc are all using drones these days for task and they do not have to get your permission to check things out, so what you MIGHT think is some random "privacy" invasion could be gas company monitoring for leaks. Down that drone and be ready to liquidate your assets for legal fees.

And YES they do use them at night for certain tasks.

You can always go through the red tape and apply to the FAA for "Restricted or Special Use" Airspace.

Sincerely,
Theis
^^These.

There were a few random news articles in my state about drones and what not a few years ago, and it led me down a rabbit hole of what is and isn't legal. Coupled with a wife that is familiar with FAA rules and regs (and who is far more rational than I am), I decided it probably wasn't in my best interest to ever just "shoot one down" as a knee-jerk reaction. Best idea I could come up with is to somehow net it or otherwise non-destructively capture it and let the douche nozzle come looking for it - which would then lead to a pretty pointed conversation (ideally with law enforcement present to take a report) about why he/she was flying a drone close enough to my property to allow me to catch it, and hopefully ending with "this is your warning".
 

ScottDWallace

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FAA does not control all airspace. It’s controls all NAVIGABLE airspace.

Navigable airspace is different for most places. If a landowner can show that he is using the space above his property, (trees, antennae, or flying below a certain elevation will damage property or spook livestock), that is not longer navigable airspace.

The current problem with drones is there is no guidance on who actually controls that non navigable airspace. It’s a literal gray area.

The FAA doesn’t control that non navigable airspace and cannot fly there. But no law or legal ruling has actually stated the landowner has control of that non navigable airspace.

This creates a pretty big gray area that will need to be addressed pretty soon.

Also, generally speaking, FAA guidelines keep manned aircraft at 500ft and higher. They may or may not still consider lower than 500 as navigable airspace, depending on the situation.

First I've heard of "navigable airspace" as it relates to the FAA. Got a source?
 

Snipe260

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If I’m on my property and someone is bothering me I’m gonna get rid of the problem.
 

Snuby642

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Laws that protect scum should be overturned, if that don't work ignored.

Hope you find drone operator and shove it up thier ass.

Put proctologist pictures from it on net.
 

The King

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I think it’s hilarious that people here:

a) indicate that people shouldn’t overfly their property with a private drone
but
b) have fucking kittens at the idea that someone would have a shooting range closed due to noise washing over their property.
 

george5419

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Property rights are fairly basic.
Drone flying is a controlled intentional thing.
it is the operators wilfull choice to violate someones private property space.
about the same as hunting with out permission on private land.

Was the shooting range there prior to the home owner that is bitching?
if so they should have considered that and shouldn't have moved into that property.....
thus: have no basis to complain except, about their own poor choice.
bout as smart as moving near an airport and then bitching about the planes.

update on actual thread
the peeping drone was back looking in the neighbors window down the road.
still no actual proof of source...
 

The King

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Pics?

Property rights are fairly basic.
Drone flying is a controlled intentional thing.
it is the operators wilfull choice to violate someones private property space.
about the same as hunting with out permission on private land.

Was the shooting range there prior to the home owner that is bitching?
if so they should have considered that and shouldn't have moved into that property.....
thus: have no basis to complain except, about their own poor choice.
bout as smart as moving near an airport and then bitching about the planes.

update on actual thread
the peeping drone was back looking in the neighbors window down the road.
still no actual proof of source...
 

Jefe's Dope

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How is flying over someone's private property a violation of their private property space? And can you define, legally, what "private property space" is?

Hunting w/o permission still places you ON private property. Flying a drone overhead is not trespassing. If it was, United, Frontier, South West, and a plethora of other airlines are trespassing my "private property space".
 

Snuby642

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Flying a drone.

If you fly it accross my place to get to point b fine.

Air craft does not stop and peer into my windows so I dont shoot at them.

Unless a .gov entity with a warrant they have no right to spy on you.
The utility companies do not stop and peek into windows so get over that crap.

I'm thinking a ham radio expert could find transmission source.

Or maybe just put out a coulple hundred watts of carrier and drop it for inspection?

Make a map of sitings , triangulate.
The drones come in cheap to .gov quality with different operating ranges.
 

The King

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If a drone is physically hovering and looking in your window you sure as hell want to have pictures of it.

Which is an asshole move - to use the shooting range example of earlier it would be like me lobbing bullets through your yard to get to my targets on the other side of your property.

Otherwise there will be pretty much fuck all to be done.

Some of people screaming “the drones is lookin in my winders!” are just people being an asshole about the drone flying overhead on its way to wherever.

They figure if they can lie their way into a real complaint they can cause some drama for someone.