BEWARE - Grrantt

308ftWIN

For Sale Access
Apr 9, 2018
36
4
8
#1
I may be paranoid but I have a bad feeling I've been duped. I'll respond with updates here. If you're in a convo with him I'd hold.

He Responded via PM to my WTB post https://forum.snipershide.com/threads/wtb-swfa-ss-3-15x42-ffp-moa-or-ares-btr-2-5-15-moa.6910155/

Offered up a SWFA for $420 shipped paypal F&F. A good deal but not otherworldly I didn't think. Noticed he had no history here so I asked and he said he had done business on smithwesson forum. I unfortunately didn't press for his UN over there after not finding a match.

I was still slightly leary so I opted to send via Paypal Purch Protection with enough extra in to cover fees and still get him his $420. He refunded that saying:

"Money came as payment on hold
I don’t use a buiness paypal so all protective payment goes on hold for 7 days
I kindly refund that payment to you because I don’t want any issues between us
As said earlier send payment as family and friends
So it get available on my balance to spend for shipping
Asking prices is $420 firm no need for extras fees with the family method
Payment of 435 refunded to you please confirm that "

This should have sent up all kinds of red flags, but, stupidly, I did it. Haven't done enough with paypal to know for sure if it would really hold up 7 days. Should have just said I was in no hurry and to let it go. I thought it was a good deal and I really wanted it to finish off a build...looking back, Who can't afford $16 to ship something now until it clears??? Duhh. I'm so stupid.

Furthermore looking back, the email he provided, his UN, and the name on the paypal account don't really make a lot of sense. The paypal email wasn't the same email as what the pictures came from.

Still a little worried, I went to digging and on Google found the pics he sent me on this post from another forum from late 2017. His first message to me was word for word the phrasing used in the attached link. I'm in the process of registering at said forum to see if I can contact the one who posted that to maybe see who they actually sold to just to be sure.

https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/swfa-3-15x42-moa.195401/


I've opened a Paypal case, but since it was F&F I'm likely done for. Haven't heard from him since yesterday morning when he confirmed he'd received the payment and would provide back shipping details. I know that's still in the window of possibility, but, given everything else I've said, I'm worried.

Stay vigilant out there, and be smarter than me.
 

KML7201

New Member
Oct 15, 2018
27
26
13
NY
#3
PayPal will not help you because you violated their terms when you sent money FF for a purchase. Hopefully you funded the PayPal payment with a credit card. If you did you can dispute the charge with your CC company, another violation of PayPal’s terms. You may get booted off PayPal but you may get your money back. Good luck.
 
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Likes: Max

308ftWIN

For Sale Access
Apr 9, 2018
36
4
8
#5
When asked for details on shipping, he did just respond, he said:

"Not yet I’m yet. TO shipping when I do I will email you details or pm it to you
I might probably do both once mailed out "
 

308ftWIN

For Sale Access
Apr 9, 2018
36
4
8
#6
PayPal will not help you because you violated their terms when you sent money FF for a purchase. Hopefully you funded the PayPal payment with a credit card. If you did you can dispute the charge with your CC company, another violation of PayPal’s terms. You may get booted off PayPal but you may get your money back. Good luck.
I'm Probably all kinds of fucked. My own fault....
 

Iamero

Full Member With Way Too Many Posts
Feb 14, 2017
5,445
146
63
#8
I know it sounds bad, but the grammar in that guy's response is a pretty good indicator something is fishy. I know not everybody types like an English major on here or via text, but those are some more red flags to look out for. I've passed up some deals and offers on here because people wouldn't call or text me. If they want to handle everything through PM or e-mail and don't have a feedback history, pass it up.
 

308ftWIN

For Sale Access
Apr 9, 2018
36
4
8
#10
He is at least responding, and Paypal apparently did take some action:

There’s no way I’m shipping to you because I just got an email that you have issued a refunds ???
And there’s a negative balance on My Paypal any reason why you would do that???


I responded with:

I in no way mean to be rude sir, If you are legit, then I am truly sorry. Here's my reasons:

1) The email you sent the pictures from wasn't the same as your paypal. (I myself have multiple emails and could look past this). The name on the Paypal account (REDACTED) also just doesn't jive with emails (REDACTED) and (REDACTED) and your UN Grrantt ...?

2) The pictures you sent, and your original message word for word, were on the web from another forum.
https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/swfa-3-15x42-moa.195401/ (again, I'm on multiple forums, it's possible that post is either yours, or you bought it then and just reused the posting to send to me, or didn't want to take your own pics...idk?.)

3) Having me swap from Paypal Purch protection to F&F puts the ball entirely in your court. I should have asked if you were okay just waiting the 7 days. I certainly was okay paying the fee. My bad for not just coming out and saying I was nervous at the time and wanted to keep the purch protection.

4) There was no member on smithandwesson forum with your name. (again, I'm on the forums with different names too and should have asked for yours before proceeding further.)

I'm not trying to get you to ship it to me and then magically the paypal refund came through.

All of those above points added up and just made me way too uncomfortable. I realize I should have done more due diligence before sending money and played my part in this too.

Again, if you are legit, I am sorry. I hope the above at least seen through my eyes is enough to be understandable.
 

Iamero

Full Member With Way Too Many Posts
Feb 14, 2017
5,445
146
63
#16
Anyone shoot a mod a message to get him shut down? Doesn't do us too much good just chatting about it otherwise, haha.
 

308ftWIN

For Sale Access
Apr 9, 2018
36
4
8
#17
Anyone shoot a mod a message to get him shut down? Doesn't do us too much good just chatting about it otherwise, haha.
I didn't want to send anyone on a witch hunt until he had a chance to possibly explain himself. But I did want to get the word out in case anyone else was working with him.

Again, I acknowledge I did a shitty job vetting this transaction and am sorry to have brought problems to the board. Obviously it'd be great if Paypal comes through and bails me out, but I've certainly learned my lesson and hope others can learn from my poor example.
 
Sep 16, 2009
4,435
431
83
#18
I don’t see that you bear any responsibility. You dealt in good faith and picked up on the signs quickly enough to avoid losing your money hopefully.
I think the main takeaway is to deal with folks who have a history on the site.
 
Likes: Stevo3556

Lowlight

HMFIC of this Shit
Staff member
Apr 12, 2001
27,230
2,978
113
Base of the Rockies
www.snipershide.com
#19
Guys we warned and warned in different sections

The scammers are out there, Grant had a proxy server recently while we are banning and not accepting a lot of accounts with proxy servers they still slip through the cracks as we get a lot of people on here.

The more popular the FS Section, the more chance of scammers targeting it.

Think boxing, protect yourself at all times. One of the reasons I am not banning people who back out of a deal they are not completely at ease with.

Don't use F&F, you lose all protections and because it's gun related lying about it makes it worse.

Our only recourse is to ban these accounts, we cannot do anything else. So if they slide in the door and you see a series of red flags, let us know, we can stop the account in its tracks. Proxies hide their location, we check but they try hiding it. Emails and User names, it's really all we have to tell, so any red flags have to be reported.
 

308ftWIN

For Sale Access
Apr 9, 2018
36
4
8
#21
Paypal denied my case. I'll see if my bank is willing to help, but I'm doubtful. Paypal probably won't like me.

Dollar for dollar, $420 is Cheaper than college tuition for the lesson I just learned....
 
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Seed tick

New Hide Member
Nov 8, 2018
5
0
1
#22
That sucks man! Hope it works out. Me and several other guys here lost dealing with a leather worker. Got me for about $350.00.
 

Tucker301

Groundskeeper
Staff member
Feb 13, 2015
7,363
4,855
113
Southern VA
#23
How to tag a mod in a post

Type the @ sign and the mod's username no spaces. Just like on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook - Like this @Tucker301

I looked at this after someone PM'd me, but Frank had already banned the scammer. I went a little deeper and looked at the IP's and found a few more using the same proxy server - banned them too.
We had three more attempts to gain new memberships using the same services since then.
Either PM us, use the report function, or at least tag us in a discussion like this.
We do not see and read every post and every thread.
We don't ban indiscriminately. We investigate, evaluate, and decide.

Everything Frank said above and more. We've even had scammers pay for access. Of course, they're using the money they stole from you, but they're willing to buy into these sections because the scores can be large enough to make it worth their while.
 
Sep 12, 2017
52
5
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#24
Have to be really careful these days, I had a guy try and scam me day before yesterday on the M14Forum, I have my WTB listings on there for an original M40 green redfield and original Issued M40A1 Simrad cap and a guy by the username “nobody1” messaged me saying he had both of them for sale and email him if I was interested, i emailed him and he sent me pictures of a run of the mill black gloss redfield that is currently for sale on eBay and I know for certain isn’t him and he sent me pics of a Unertl mount instead of a Simrad cap, he obviously has no idea what a Simrad cap is and I informed him that that is not the correct scope and I wasn’t interested and to send me more pictures of the Unertl mount because I was interested in that, I had seen pics of that Unertl mount on google before and right away knew he was trying to scam me, he replied with a email that said “here you go” and just sent more pics of the black scope from eBay and sent none of the mount. Once I called him out on it he has not emailed me back since. This time last year had another person on the M14forum message me saying that he had a real usmc DMR stock for sale and tried to have me send him money before I saw any pics, he originally sent pics of a real DMR stock on google images and when I asked for more pics sent me pics of an Airsoft plastic DMR stock. Got to be really careful these days about dealing with some people on the forums but there are some definite dead giveaways that these people both had. First was that they both created their forum account the day they messaged me and had no history other than messaging me. Second would be that most of these guys don’t type or communicate with very good grammar and sent short responses, third they take longer than normal to respond back, fourth most pics they send are relatively easy to find on google images, And fifth noticed unusual forum names and their emails were almost indentical with their forum username. Just sharing the 2 experiences I had and I’m sure there are more sophisticated people out there like this posts situation that are willing to go above and beyond to screw good guys over...always got to stay vigilant.
 
Feb 13, 2017
99
23
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#28
As soon as you put up a WTB ad you open yourself up to scammers. This was a huge problem with the old sturmgewehr.com site. These guys can be very convincing. I always ask for them to write my name or email on a piece of paper and put it partially UNDER the item that is for sale. Harder to photoshop that request. At least it was not thousands of dollars.
 
Oct 30, 2018
2
0
1
#29
As soon as you put up a WTB ad you open yourself up to scammers. This was a huge problem with the old sturmgewehr.com site. These guys can be very convincing. I always ask for them to write my name or email on a piece of paper and put it partially UNDER the item that is for sale. Harder to photoshop that request. At least it was not thousands of dollars.
That’s always my go to for verification. My name, date, and time stamp on a piece of paper next to the item for sale.