Anyone heard from Leviathan or gotten their suppressor? UPDATE

mercracing

Sergeant
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Feb 9, 2013
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Green Bay, WI
#1
Anyone heard from him? Anyone gotten a can yet from them? I know Franks used them and a top PRS guy has one. I know he’s making cans cuz I can see it on IG that CORE is getting a bunch. I’ve left phone messages, FB messages, and now Hide messages just wondering what’s going on.

Anyone?

@GunFreak0814
 
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mercracing

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Feb 9, 2013
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Green Bay, WI
#2
So heres the story. I won a 50% off cert in May. I called Leviathan and ordered the suppressor, paying my half in full. A month later I get a call saying the Form 3 has gone through and I can start the Form 4. Get that done end of June. Still no suppressor. I have repeatedly tried to contact Chris and Leviathan with no result. I was told 6 weeks tops. I am now way past 6 weeks. The ATF cashed my check, and I'm seeing approvals getting closer and closer to when I should be getting mine. I have been calling, texting, leaving voicemail, FB personal page, FB company page, a PM here, and IG company page. I’ve been blocked on everywhere but here. I know he is making suppressors, I was seeing it on his IG page before he blocked me. I would like to warn people to be leery about doing business with him since I started in May and have nothing to show for it.

I have records of most everything.
 

mercracing

Sergeant
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Feb 9, 2013
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Green Bay, WI
#4
My man, your form 4 will take 6 months minimum, more likely 12 months. I don't know who told you 6 weeks but that is incorrect by a factor of 10 at least
The six weeks is what I was told for when the suppressor would be built, and shipped to my dealer. I expect 5-7 months for completed Form 4
 

Kadams1563

Giver of Bad Advice
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Feb 13, 2017
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#6
3-4 months for individual form 4’s.

Trust that’s another story.

I don’t understand these companies that pop up and make a product and do not deliver. I have a friend that’s going through this with a Curtis custom action. He has done the same. Very available until they get the money.

Why anyone would buy a suppressor not from a big company that’s gonna be around awhile is beyond me.
 

GunFreak0814

Private
Hessian
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Apr 23, 2017
8
14
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#7
Aaron there’s a problem. Calling someone every 10 days to 2 weeks asking where something is doesn’t accomplish anything! In fact it hurts a relationship. I get up everyday at 4 am and go to work. I’m not calling you tonight because I’m literally laying in bed (I don’t care if you don’t believe that or not, it’s what I’m doing right now). I get up, drink a pot of coffee, make sure my wife gets off to work, then I head down the shop. Once I’m at the shop I start things that I didn’t finish the night before. I also have a personal life outside of building cans. I handle all the phone calls, I handle all of the emails, I handle all of the website maintenance, I handle all of the delivery’s, running back to the post office or Ups or FedEx, I talk to all of the dealers constantly. I talk to my shooters. I order titanium, I order titanium tubing, I program machines for the tasks I have, I run a lathe as well. I build ALL of the cans. So I’m sorry if something takes longer than 6 weeks. If you treat other companies the same way you’ve treated me and Leviathan Suppressors, you should consider a different tone and have different expectations. You were blocked because you won’t leave me alone, if I’m constantly talking to ONE customer it takes time from my entire day and other customers! Be patient!
 

mercracing

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Feb 9, 2013
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#8
Quick response before bed, longer one tomorrow. It took effort for you to block me without saying anything. Wouldn’t it have been better for everyone if you would have sent a messsge? Even a simple one saying you would get with me Monday.
 
Likes: Max

mercracing

Sergeant
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Feb 9, 2013
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Green Bay, WI
#9
Slightly longer response.
Chris, I completely understand your the one guy doing everything. I'm sure it is monumental. I didn't want to have to make this post, I just wanted the suppressor I paid for. Or even some kind of response. Things fall behind, of course things happen. I get it. I'm more understanding than you give me credit for. However, the last response I got was a month ago(and I have proof that's the last time you responded) you blew me off and said I was one of 42 you were working on? So you started building my suppressor in May/beginning of June and here we are in October and all you know is I'm in a batch of 42? I'm sorry if the once a month was too much, but I figured since you were posting on IG you would be able to respond. Call me tomorrow.
 
Likes: Max

MinnesotaMulisha

Head MF Door Keeper
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Jul 30, 2013
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#12
Slightly longer response.
Chris, I completely understand your the one guy doing everything. I'm sure it is monumental. I didn't want to have to make this post, I just wanted the suppressor I paid for. Or even some kind of response. Things fall behind, of course things happen. I get it. I'm more understanding than you give me credit for. However, the last response I got was a month ago(and I have proof that's the last time you responded) you blew me off and said I was one of 42 you were working on? So you started building my suppressor in May/beginning of June and here we are in October and all you know is I'm in a batch of 42? I'm sorry if the once a month was too much, but I figured since you were posting on IG you would be able to respond. Call me tomorrow.
In your second post, you make it sound like you were contacting him much more frequently than once a month.
 

cleric

Private
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Nov 13, 2011
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Dallas, tx
#14
So heres the story. I won a 50% off cert in May. I called Leviathan and ordered the suppressor, paying my half in full. A month later I get a call saying the Form 3 has gone through and I can start the Form 4. Get that done end of June. Still no suppressor. I have repeatedly tried to contact Chris and Leviathan with no result. I was told 6 weeks tops. I am now way past 6 weeks. The ATF cashed my check, and I'm seeing approvals getting closer and closer to when I should be getting mine. I have been calling, texting, leaving voicemail, FB personal page, FB company page, a PM here, and IG company page. I’ve been blocked on everywhere but here. I know he is making suppressors, I was seeing it on his IG page before he blocked me. I would like to warn people to be leery about doing business with him since I started in May and have nothing to show for it.

I have records of most everything.

So you pay in May? How can the form 3 be completed before the can is? Unless he created the registered part and had it processed before the can was finished. But why would you f3 an incomplete can let alone f4. If something happens and that serialized part goes bad you are up a creek.

How did 6-8 weeks become 5+ months?
 
Likes: Max

mercracing

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Feb 9, 2013
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#16
Chris called me the Monday morning after I posted this. He apologized for being hard to get ahold of. He said my baffles were built, but he was waiting on my tube. He also informed me that dealer orders come first. I emailed him on October 29th asking if there were any updates and he said nothing yet.
 

D46Infinity

Full Member
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Feb 13, 2017
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#20
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but the parts (external) on leviathian’s cans look to be very close to those parts made by diversified machine or could possibly be subcontracted out and finished by leviathan.

I’ve seen a few manufacturers register a tube once it has been cut and threaded and submit the form 3 for transfer. But I’m still a little confused about submitting a form 3 on a tube that is not in the manufacturers hands.

Now how would you be able to submit a form 4 from your local dealer to you personal collection that your dealer doesn’t have in his local inventory. I don’t know any dealer that would sign a form 4 to transfer out any NFA that they don’t have in their hands as a transfer is not completed or valid (on a form 3) until it has been delivered.
 
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Geno C.

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Oct 24, 2007
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#21
I’ve sent in form 4 quite often once the form 3 has been approved. Every little bit of the wait that I could shave off I do usually.
 

mercracing

Sergeant
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Feb 9, 2013
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#22
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but the parts (external) on leviathian’s cans look to be very close to those parts made by diversified machine or could possibly be subcontracted out and finished by leviathan.

I’ve seen a few manufacturers register a tube once it has been cut and threaded and submit the form 3 for transfer. But I’m still a little confused about submitting a form 3 on a tube that is not in the manufacturers hands.

Now how would you be able to submit a form 4 from your local dealer to you personal collection that your dealer doesn’t have in his local inventory. I don’t know any dealer that would sign a form 4 to transfer out any NFA that they don’t have in their hands as a transfer is not completed or valid (on a form 3) until it has been delivered.
Not trying to argue, where did you hear about DM doing some of the work for Leviathan? I hadn’t heard that.
 

lte82

Shooter
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Mar 12, 2013
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#23
So heres the story. I won a 50% off cert in May. I called Leviathan and ordered the suppressor, paying my half in full. A month later I get a call saying the Form 3 has gone through and I can start the Form 4. Get that done end of June. Still no suppressor. I have repeatedly tried to contact Chris and Leviathan with no result. I was told 6 weeks tops. I am now way past 6 weeks. The ATF cashed my check, and I'm seeing approvals getting closer and closer to when I should be getting mine. I have been calling, texting, leaving voicemail, FB personal page, FB company page, a PM here, and IG company page. I’ve been blocked on everywhere but here. I know he is making suppressors, I was seeing it on his IG page before he blocked me. I would like to warn people to be leery about doing business with him since I started in May and have nothing to show for it.

I have records of most everything.
Wait, so you have your tax stamp back?
 

cleric

Private
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Nov 13, 2011
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Dallas, tx
#26
Really?! Doesn’t seem that hard to follow. Guy pays for can, form 3 is approved, he submits form 4, months go by and the can hasn’t even shown up at the dealer yet.

That’s what I’ve gotten from this so far
So f3 a non completed can is a bad idea...

Submitting a f4 on a can that is not in dealer inventory is a bad idea
 

cleric

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#28
And this situation is why it’s bad idea...

According to the nfa records per the f3 there is a can at your dealer. Per the f4 both of you signed there was a can in the dealers bound book. But there is no item in the bound book. Most dealers I know will not drop a f4 until the f3 is in their hands. They will do their own qc on the f3 before signing the f4.

People were trying to skirt the system to reduce your time, but it has the potential to create problems. If your f4 gets approved and then the can is dmg or lost in mail, what happens then?
 

Max

Descendant of John Adams
Belligerents
#29
And this situation is why it’s bad idea...

According to the nfa records per the f3 there is a can at your dealer. Per the f4 both of you signed there was a can in the dealers bound book. But there is no item in the bound book. Most dealers I know will not drop a f4 until the f3 is in their hands. They will do their own qc on the f3 before signing the f4.

People were trying to skirt the system to reduce your time, but it has the potential to create problems. If your f4 gets approved and then the can is dmg or lost in mail, what happens then?
I was confused where you were headed but this post is inline with what I thought was the norm. My FFL (also a suppressor manufacturer) won’t do Form 4 until they have a transferred form 3 can in hand . With good reason.....
 

mercracing

Sergeant
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Feb 9, 2013
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Green Bay, WI
#30
And this situation is why it’s bad idea...

According to the nfa records per the f3 there is a can at your dealer. Per the f4 both of you signed there was a can in the dealers bound book. But there is no item in the bound book. Most dealers I know will not drop a f4 until the f3 is in their hands. They will do their own qc on the f3 before signing the f4.

People were trying to skirt the system to reduce your time, but it has the potential to create problems. If your f4 gets approved and then the can is dmg or lost in mail, what happens then?
Yes looking back now I would wait. However I had no reason to not to believe my dealer would have my can by now.

As I understand it part of the ATF doing what they do is to verify my dealer has the can. If he doesn’t when they call I assume they will deny my form 4.
 

Max

Descendant of John Adams
Belligerents
#32
Yes looking back now I would wait. However I had no reason to not to believe my dealer would have my can by now.

As I understand it part of the ATF doing what they do is to verify my dealer has the can. If he doesn’t when they call I assume they will deny my form 4.
This process is difficult, and more importantly, stressful enough with the ATF application process, setting up trusts, pictures , prints months of waiting etc. We’ll look forward to the day this is all said and done with lessons learned. I know I certainly have gained some knowledge here.....
 

olive drab

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Jan 8, 2009
251
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Virginia
#33
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but the parts (external) on leviathian’s cans look to be very close to those parts made by diversified machine or could possibly be subcontracted out and finished by leviathan.

I’ve seen a few manufacturers register a tube once it has been cut and threaded and submit the form 3 for transfer. But I’m still a little confused about submitting a form 3 on a tube that is not in the manufacturers hands.

Now how would you be able to submit a form 4 from your local dealer to you personal collection that your dealer doesn’t have in his local inventory. I don’t know any dealer that would sign a form 4 to transfer out any NFA that they don’t have in their hands as a transfer is not completed or valid (on a form 3) until it has been delivered.
Thats crazy if that is the case. Chris at DM isnt the easiest one to get a hold of either which is probably exacerbating this problem further. FYI i just had a form 3 from Southern precision to my dealer take 3-4 weeks so if this guy somehow blames the ATF, that wont hold any water.
 

cleric

Private
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Nov 13, 2011
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Dallas, tx
#34
I've had it suggested to me previously on two occasions by different dealers so evidently it is relatively common.

So you can. But the question is the risk. According to the nfa the dealer has asserted that he has the can. If his audit came due the atf would bring the list and expect it to be there but guess what it’s not
 

18Echo

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Jun 12, 2007
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#35
Those cans on his sight look remarkably similar to the Diversified Machine products. OP could have bought the parts and done it himself with e-form 1 quicker. I'd hate to pay $1095 for their flagship can and find out it has about 300 dollars worth of DM parts.
 
Likes: Eagle1899

JTC1967

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Online Training Access
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Nov 2, 2017
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#38
Yes looking back now I would wait. However I had no reason to not to believe my dealer would have my can by now.

As I understand it part of the ATF doing what they do is to verify my dealer has the can. If he doesn’t when they call I assume they will deny my form 4.
I don't see how playing fast and loose with who-has-what-when will help you in the long run. I am amazed that your FFL would submit the F4 w/o possessing the NFA item. BATFE audit would go sideways for him if it occurred. Just put on the big-boy pants and wait - it takes the time that it takes, government shut-downs not withstanding.
 

mercracing

Sergeant
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Feb 9, 2013
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Green Bay, WI
#39
Have you received your can yet?
No I do not have the can yet.

I don't see how playing fast and loose with who-has-what-when will help you in the long run. I am amazed that your FFL would submit the F4 w/o possessing the NFA item. BATFE audit would go sideways for him if it occurred. Just put on the big-boy pants and wait - it takes the time that it takes, government shut-downs not withstanding.
That’s what I’ve been doin man. All I can do is wait. No worries.