300 Norma Mag

Gilly

On Target
Feb 27, 2009
472
18
18
Coloarado
The difference in freebore requirements between the Warner and the others is huge, so you won’t ideally be able to run those three bullets in the same chamber. The Warner reamer is .112 freebore, and the 215/230 needs somewhere between .215 (saami) and .300. I had zero luck with the Warner 198 in my my gun and just re-throated my barrel to accomodate the heavy jacketed bullets. My barrel is an 8 twist Bartlein. Best I could do with the Warner 198 was about 5 moa at 640 yds. Bummer, I was really hoping they’d work. I switched to 208 eld and 215 hyb just to try and diagnose the problem. Even though they were seated way down past the neck in the Warner chamber, groups dropped to sub half minute at the same distance.
Thanks for the heads up on that. Expensive bullets to get a barrel chambered up specifically to run and not get performance out of them. Not to mention finding a 9 twist AXMC blank is not an easy task where a 10 twist seems easier to find. Maybe I should rethink what I want to do. The 215 berger at 3050-3150 from some loads I have seen here is nothing to sneeze at!
 
Sep 6, 2006
1,918
126
63
Southern California
Thanks for the heads up on that. Expensive bullets to get a barrel chambered up specifically to run and not get performance out of them. Not to mention finding a 9 twist AXMC blank is not an easy task where a 10 twist seems easier to find. Maybe I should rethink what I want to do. The 215 berger at 3050-3150 from some loads I have seen here is nothing to sneeze at!

It’s unfortunate for sure. I really liked dealing with Dan and crew, excellent CS. Don’t mind the cost of them either. If they make some changes i’d try them again.

Youre right about rhe 215. Don’t overlook the 225 eld too. Exceeds the 230 bc for $20/box less.




 

kthomas

Sergeant
Jun 17, 2009
511
56
28
30
Houston, TX
It’s unfortunate for sure. I really liked dealing with Dan and crew, excellent CS. Don’t mind the cost of them either. If they make some changes i’d try them again.

Youre right about rhe 215. Don’t overlook the 225 eld too. Exceeds the 230 bc for $20/box less.
Have you tried the cutting edge Lazer series? May be worth a shot. I don't have any measurements off hand, but they look like they could possibly work in a SAAMI spec chamber. Supposedly transition into transonic much better as well.

Disappointing to hear about the Warner's, as they have an impressive BC. I've got a few that I'm going to try out, as well as the CEB's and the Badlands Precision bullets.

At the end of the day, I have a feeling it's going to be hard to beat the 230 hybrids. The solids have their work cut out for them.
 
Just received my 300 NM and could use some guidance on load development. To start out I bought some Retumbo, H1000, and R33 along with Berger 230s. I bought 40 pieces of new Norma branded brass. I had a die cut specifically for the ABM230s. I gave the tool maker 5 rounds so he could cut a chamber specifically to shoot this round. To fire form the brass, I loaded the minimum start load of 84.5 grains of Retumbo per the chart below.
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 7"].300 Norma Magnum[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 7"]230 Grain, PN: 30428 Bullet, CIP 3.680" COAL, 26" Barrel. 1/6/2015 RB[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Bullet[/TD]
[TD]Powder[/TD]
[TD]Start Load In Grains[/TD]
[TD]Approx. Start Velocity[/TD]
[TD]Max. Load In Grains[/TD]
[TD]Approx. Max. Velocity[/TD]
[TD]Fill Ratio[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Alliant RE 25[/TD]
[TD]78.0[/TD]
[TD]2695[/TD]
[TD]82.3[/TD]
[TD]2821[/TD]
[TD]93%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Hodgdon Retumbo[/TD]
[TD]84.5[/TD]
[TD]2735[/TD]
[TD]89.1[/TD]
[TD]2874[/TD]
[TD]100%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Hodgdon US 869[/TD]
[TD]94.0[/TD]
[TD]2669[/TD]
[TD]99.2[/TD]
[TD]2844[/TD]
[TD]105%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Hodgdon H50BMG[/TD]
[TD]90.0[/TD]
[TD]2682[/TD]
[TD]94.7[/TD]
[TD]2848[/TD]
[TD]105%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Alliant RE 50[/TD]
[TD]93.5[/TD]
[TD]2736[/TD]
[TD]98.6[/TD]
[TD]2913[/TD]
[TD]103%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE]
[TR]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Because I lost my formal shooting range to the Napa fires, The first shooting of my new rifle was from a mountaintop at a gong 600 yards away. I just roughed out a zero and shot the 40 rounds at the gong. My initial impressions are WOW what a hammer attached to a later beam. A friend had a Lab Radar and recorded 2881-2893 fps vs 2735 predicted above. Granted I have a new Proof 28” barrel with a tight chamber but I was surprised to get 150 fps more than expected.

Now I have fresh fire formed cases, cases neck sized with .002 neck tension, trimmed, a somewhat conditioned barrel, Im ready to work on load development. I thought I would start a load, increasing by .2 grains, looking for a flat spot in velocity around 3000 fps. Question is, where should I start the initial load? The purpose of the rifle is just to be a fun shooter, working steel to 2000 yards. Any other suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated. I am super impressed with the potential of this caliber and look forward to wearing out at least one barrel a year.

Thanks in advance.
 

bjay

Private
Oct 19, 2009
2,744
48
48
Aloha state HI
Just received my 300 NM and could use some guidance on load development. To start out I bought some Retumbo, H1000, and R33 along with Berger 230s. I bought 40 pieces of new Norma branded brass. I had a die cut specifically for the ABM230s. I gave the tool maker 5 rounds so he could cut a chamber specifically to shoot this round. To fire form the brass, I loaded the minimum start load of 84.5 grains of Retumbo per the chart below.
[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 7"].300 Norma Magnum[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 7"]230 Grain, PN: 30428 Bullet, CIP 3.680" COAL, 26" Barrel. 1/6/2015 RB[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Bullet[/TD]
[TD]Powder[/TD]
[TD]Start Load In Grains[/TD]
[TD]Approx. Start Velocity[/TD]
[TD]Max. Load In Grains[/TD]
[TD]Approx. Max. Velocity[/TD]
[TD]Fill Ratio[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Alliant RE 25[/TD]
[TD]78.0[/TD]
[TD]2695[/TD]
[TD]82.3[/TD]
[TD]2821[/TD]
[TD]93%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Hodgdon Retumbo[/TD]
[TD]84.5[/TD]
[TD]2735[/TD]
[TD]89.1[/TD]
[TD]2874[/TD]
[TD]100%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Hodgdon US 869[/TD]
[TD]94.0[/TD]
[TD]2669[/TD]
[TD]99.2[/TD]
[TD]2844[/TD]
[TD]105%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Hodgdon H50BMG[/TD]
[TD]90.0[/TD]
[TD]2682[/TD]
[TD]94.7[/TD]
[TD]2848[/TD]
[TD]105%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]230 Grain[/TD]
[TD]Alliant RE 50[/TD]
[TD]93.5[/TD]
[TD]2736[/TD]
[TD]98.6[/TD]
[TD]2913[/TD]
[TD]103%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE]
[TR]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Because I lost my formal shooting range to the Napa fires, The first shooting of my new rifle was from a mountaintop at a gong 600 yards away. I just roughed out a zero and shot the 40 rounds at the gong. My initial impressions are WOW what a hammer attached to a later beam. A friend had a Lab Radar and recorded 2881-2893 fps vs 2735 predicted above. Granted I have a new Proof 28” barrel with a tight chamber but I was surprised to get 150 fps more than expected.

Now I have fresh fire formed cases, cases neck sized with .002 neck tension, trimmed, a somewhat conditioned barrel, Im ready to work on load development. I thought I would start a load, increasing by .2 grains, looking for a flat spot in velocity around 3000 fps. Question is, where should I start the initial load? The purpose of the rifle is just to be a fun shooter, working steel to 2000 yards. Any other suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated. I am super impressed with the potential of this caliber and look forward to wearing out at least one barrel a year.

Thanks in advance.
If this a fresh barrel. You should be seeing a gain fps after barrel settled.. For 28" you should see 3100 pretty easy with 230s.. Barrel aint cheap specially proof carbon if i can get 3050 with great accuracy from a set up like that id be happy.. I tried rl33 and it does give more fps vs h1000 and retumbo but its not as temperature stable. Its a ELR rifle for me so id stick to powder that dont give dramatically shift in impact specially at longer distance on different day/temperature..
 
Sep 12, 2007
68
0
6
Huntingdon,Pa 16652
I tried rl33 and it does give more fps vs h1000 and retumbo but its not as temperature stable. Its a ELR rifle for me so id stick to powder that dont give dramatically shift in impact specially at longer distance on different day/temperature.

i can verify that too. i did a test in 20*f and lost 85fps from 70*f with RL33.

i get a weird bolt lift with Retumbo and H1000 that i do not feel with RL33 , lift is tighter with a double click at times with several charge weights? any thoughts?

i am considering trying N570 but never used the VIHT line of powder and it is rather pricey locally compared to RL33.

how temp stable is it relative to H and RL?

230OTM 300NM @3k 26"bbl


fyi, 3 cases were sent to forster to make my dies. I have 3-4 or so firings from my Norma brass and some pockets are coming loose, is it just time for new brass?
 

bjay

Private
Oct 19, 2009
2,744
48
48
Aloha state HI
I tried rl33 and it does give more fps vs h1000 and retumbo but its not as temperature stable. Its a ELR rifle for me so id stick to powder that dont give dramatically shift in impact specially at longer distance on different day/temperature.

i can verify that too. i did a test in 20*f and lost 85fps from 70*f with RL33.

i get a weird bolt lift with Retumbo and H1000 that i do not feel with RL33 , lift is tighter with a double click at times with several charge weights? any thoughts?

i am considering trying N570 but never used the VIHT line of powder and it is rather pricey locally compared to RL33.

how temp stable is it relative to H and RL?

230OTM 300NM @3k 26"bbl


fyi, 3 cases were sent to forster to make my dies. I have 3-4 or so firings from my Norma brass and some pockets are coming loose, is it just time for new brass?
Ive been using standard 300nm brass..5-7x and i called it DEAD..ive been testing lapua 423 dakota necked down and turned neck to 300nm..15-17x loads and pockets still feels like a new NORMA brass..and i load them to i got ejector marks and flat fed215m primer lol photo86789.jpg
 
Sep 6, 2006
1,918
126
63
Southern California
I tried rl33 and it does give more fps vs h1000 and retumbo but its not as temperature stable. Its a ELR rifle for me so id stick to powder that dont give dramatically shift in impact specially at longer distance on different day/temperature.

i can verify that too. i did a test in 20*f and lost 85fps from 70*f with RL33.

i get a weird bolt lift with Retumbo and H1000 that i do not feel with RL33 , lift is tighter with a double click at times with several charge weights? any thoughts?

i am considering trying N570 but never used the VIHT line of powder and it is rather pricey locally compared to RL33.

how temp stable is it relative to H and RL?

230OTM 300NM @3k 26"bbl


fyi, 3 cases were sent to forster to make my dies. I have 3-4 or so firings from my Norma brass and some pockets are coming loose, is it just time for new brass?
Your sticky bolt with retumbo and h1000 is just excessive pressure, nothing more.


Lapua and peterson are about to drop the norma brass, so the should solve the weak primer pocket issues.


 
Sep 12, 2007
68
0
6
Huntingdon,Pa 16652
Your sticky bolt with retumbo and h1000 is just excessive pressure, nothing more.


Lapua and peterson are about to drop the norma brass, so the should solve the weak primer pocket issues.
thank you for the verification, i was thinking that but not certain. i ordered 300 - 230 tgt Hybrids and going to stick with rl33 then. looking hard at n570 though but not sure if the cost difference is worth it?

i signed up to test Peterson brass but have not heard a peep back? not is 300NM listed on their site. if they keep snoozing Lapua will be the winner, which is fine with me!

who is carrying the Lapua brass?
 
Dec 19, 2017
3
0
0
This was the reply from lapu/capstone when inquiring when the 300 Norma brass will be available:

This brass should be available stateside mid to late 2nd quarter through most of our master dealers.
 
Aug 23, 2017
151
4
18
My gunsmith has a reamer that has a .125 freebore. I am wanting to shoot the 215 berger hybrids. Will this work or do I need to get back in touch with him and discuss a reamer with more freebore?
 

bjay

Private
Oct 19, 2009
2,744
48
48
Aloha state HI
My gunsmith has a reamer that has a .125 freebore. I am wanting to shoot the 215 berger hybrids. Will this work or do I need to get back in touch with him and discuss a reamer with more freebore?
My shortest Freebore was 210 and works well with 210 vld and 215 hybrids..IMO that bit short but mostly smith has troater anyway
 

Gilly

On Target
Feb 27, 2009
472
18
18
Coloarado
Got my 28” 9 twist 300 Norma out for first load development this week. 198 Flatline looks like it will be around 3090 with 84 RL26 using Warner’s 3.765 OAL jumping a long ways, more than I like, but groups were promising. More load development tomorrow.

Also my 230 Sierras showed up, will try to get a start on that this weekend too!

Left to right 215 berger-230 berger hybrid-230 Sierra
FD454D6A-5AD7-4F82-982B-7C7AD5F601D9.jpeg
 

Gilly

On Target
Feb 27, 2009
472
18
18
Coloarado
Made it out shooting Norma today for second time and I’m more than impressed. I took the high node from first ladder test and loaded up 15. Fired the first 4 rounds at 100 well under half inch and averaged 3145 over lab radar. Was warmer today than last time but supposedly that 15 degree change shouldn’t bother RL26.

After those at a 100 I went right to 980. AB told me 5.2 mil and shot high, ended up at 5.0 for impact on next 3 rounds. Couldn’t see splash on plate so went out to check, 2 near dead center one 7” low. I was happy with results for only 20-25 rounds at this point. Me and a buddy sent a few more impacts at 980, thing is a laser!

Moved out to 1580 with last few rounds, wind was getting gusty at this point 13-16 mph AB said 11.3 mil elevation and by the time I walked it down to where I wasn’t shooting over berms behind target I was at 10.8 mil elevation needed! Ran out of ammo before getting last bit of wind dialed in. This shows a calibration velocity of 3202. Can’t wait to go back to 1580 on next trip. 48C02153-ABAB-4533-96DE-235A5F51FCB2.jpeg

Norma brass
84.0 RL26
198 Flatline
3.765”

980 target
 
Last edited:
Dec 30, 2017
1
0
1
Pacific Northwet
Made it out shooting Norma today for second time and I’m more than impressed. I took the high node from first ladder test and loaded up 15. Fired the first 4 rounds at 100 well under half inch and averaged 3145 over lab radar. Was warmer today than last time but supposedly that 15 degree change shouldn’t bother RL26.

After those at a 100 I went right to 980. AB told me 5.2 mil and shot high, ended up at 5.0 for impact on next 3 rounds. Couldn’t see splash on plate so went out to check, 2 near dead center one 7” low. I was happy with results for only 20-25 rounds at this point. Me and a buddy sent a few more impacts at 980, thing is a laser!

Moved out to 1580 with last few rounds, wind was getting gusty at this point 13-16 mph AB said 11.3 mil elevation and by the time I walked it down to where I wasn’t shooting over berms behind target I was at 10.8 mil elevation needed! Ran out of ammo before getting last bit of wind dialed in. This shows a calibration velocity of 3202. Can’t wait to go back to 1580 on next trip.


Norma brass
84.0 RL26
3.765”

980 target
Very nice!
Which bullet did you use for these loads?
 

Gilly

On Target
Feb 27, 2009
472
18
18
Coloarado
Ok another range trip and getting settled in on some loads. Accuracy is awesome with both loads. Haven’t take the 230 to distance yet but will soon. 300 Norma is here to stay for me!

AIAX MC rifle
28” 1:9 Bartlien

230 Sierra
Norma brass
Cci 250
84-84.5 Retumbo node
3.685 OAL (.015 jump)
2945
Made it past 3000 with 86 but had pressure signs.

198 Flatline
Norma brass
Cci 250
3.765 OAL
84 RL26
3145

1580 yard target 198 load. Could’ve used another .1-.2 elevation but spotting these at distance is tough! Two center hits low are 198 the other 3 are 7 saum using 180’s
55EAEDE6-700A-47E8-9503-D599408E9870.jpeg
 
Likes: Bravo6niner
Jul 2, 2011
75
0
6
45
Anyone here good at calculating ogive to the lands distance if I give them my reamer specs and bullet dimensions? If so PM me please. Need some numbers crunched for my 300 Norma.